log052800

Session Start: Sun May 28 20:13:55 2000
*** Now talking in #SpiritualPersistence
*** Topic is ' 2,4~ Tonight's 2,7Topic: 2,8"RR & E's Points to Ponder" 2,9Sunday 2,11May 28 0,12at 9pm 2,13EDT ~ 0,2Hosted by Rev. Dr. Randolph Becker & Elissa Bishop Becker (and Rikkity). URL: www.spiritualpersistence.com '

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RevRandy. . . .so welcome y'all
StF. . . .Hi Elissa!
Elissa. . . .hi guys!!!
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Elissa. . . .((((((TF))))))
StF. . . .Hi TF
TF88. . . .Hi Elissa, randy, ezwind and stf
ezwind. . . .hi, TF

RevRandy. . . .well, friends, the time has come
RevRandy. . . .to speak of many things
RevRandy. . . .of PtoPs, and SP, and a whole host of spiritual things
RevRandy. . . .Welcome to SP
Elissa. . . .welcome!
RevRandy. . . .our weekly consideration of ..... nearly everything
Elissa. . . .have we got a show for you tonight! lol
RevRandy. . . .Elissa - I don't think we need the intro tonight
Elissa. . . .i don't theeeenk so :)
RevRandy. . . .so, let's move right into the invocation
RevRandy. . . .please join in the spirit of these words
RevRandy. . . .May we be connected to all things loving
RevRandy. . . .Protected from all things evil
RevRandy. . . .And guided in all ways gracious.
RevRandy. . . .AMen
Elissa. . . .amen~
StF. . . .Amen
TF88. . . .peace
ezwind. . . .Amen, I love those words.
Elissa. . . .:)
Elissa. . . .(ez feel free to use them in your ministry)
RevRandy. . . .In fact, everyone: they make wonderful interfaith invocations
RevRandy. . . .whenever I use those words in a public setting, I receive more comments than about any other prayer I give
RevRandy. . . .Tonight we are continuing to share and explore
RevRandy. . . .the Points to Ponder that speak the loudest or the subtlest to Elissa and me
RevRandy. . . .we have each, from each category, chosen one
RevRandy. . . .so, on with the show -
RevRandy. . . .TIME
RevRandy. . . . 0,2"You can't and shouldn't live without a past.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2If you give up things you'd rather forget, you also give up what you should remember.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2"Just as it is not good to live only in the present, it is not good to be obsessed with the past.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2Balance.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2Live today, remembering yesterday, and dreaming of tomorrow.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2But don't live by yesterday's losses or tomorrow's promises. How can you learn and remember if you live like you forget.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2If your memories are just painful, you have
RevRandy. . . . 0,2If your memories are just painful, you have not yet learned.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2"Do you want to throw out the past. No. Ok, then integrate it into life.
RevRandy. . . . 0,2Don't measure everything by what was, but also value what was. Ponder this." (4/14/96 - B#8)
RevRandy. . . .This speaks to me
RevRandy. . . .because it is an area of life I struggle with on a regular basis
RevRandy. . . .on the one hand I can venerate the past, lost in its meanings
RevRandy. . . .and on the other, I am constantly scanning the horizon.
RevRandy. . . .Many years ago, in my first marriage, I had a son who was born with severe medical problems
RevRandy. . . .and after dealing with that passage of severe loss,
RevRandy. . . .I tried to get on with my life by erasing the past
RevRandy. . . .new hairstyle (and for those who know me, you know this was hard to do)
RevRandy. . . .new glasses,
RevRandy. . . .different clothes
RevRandy. . . .a new car
RevRandy. . . .many changes.
RevRandy. . . .I tried to live without remembering the past.
RevRandy. . . .But, when I did that I also threw out much of the past I wanted to or needed to keep
RevRandy. . . .I thought the way past pain was to avoid it
RevRandy. . . .And other times I know I deal with the "what thens" of tomorrow rather than try to fit into the present.
RevRandy. . . .So, I struggle
RevRandy. . . .until I hear this .... and especially about memories being painful until I have learned.
RevRandy. . . .If the task of life is learning and remembering .... we can't learn from what we don't remember
RevRandy. . . .and we can remember what we have not learned.
RevRandy. . . .Avoidance takes away both sides of the equation
RevRandy. . . .So now I seek that balance, the blend of past, present , and future
RevRandy. . . .So I can live with my past, no matter how painful or trying
RevRandy. . . .for I know only in it is my life rooted and anchored, even as I now grow beyond those past places.
RevRandy. . . .But, what do you all see or hear in this?
Elissa. . . .((((((randy))))))
RevRandy. . . .ty
TF88. . . .I have friends...a couple...we nearly lost one of them when she had a stroke at 31
TF88. . . .it was a terrible time, of course
TF88. . . .and she was not expected to survive
TF88. . . .but she recovered
TF88. . . .completely...very much a miracle
TF88. . . .but I watch as her husband
TF88. . . .looks back on that time
TF88. . . .and he avoids looking at it...
TF88. . . .saying he wants to pretend it never happened
TF88. . . .but I wish he would look back,
TF88. . . .because he is missing the incredible miracle that took place
TF88. . . .she is thriving now
StF. . . .Yes, so many ppl avoid "looking" because of the fear of remembering the "bad"
Elissa. . . .is your sense that he avoids looking back because he doesn't feel he could deal with what happened at the time?
TF88. . . .but he misses the wonderful changes that have happened as a result of that experience
TF88. . . .right elissa...it's too difficult for him
Elissa. . . .yes, i see that so often
TF88. . . .he is depressed every year on the anniversary of when she almost died
StF. . . .But something Rikkity said, struck me...."Don't measure everything by what was.."
StF. . . .When we learn to see the pain as a growth experience, it becomes less painful
Elissa. . . .yes stf, we need to put things in perspective and the only way to do that is to accept all life offers
TF88. . . .I always suggest he celebrate the anniversary of when she was released from rehab
RevRandy. . . .yes, so true - but hard to learn
StF. . . .yes, hard to learn....
StF. . . .But Rikkity also said "Value what was"...encouraging... :)
Elissa. . . .tf, he needs to go back and feel what he didn't feel then--difficult to do without a lot of courage and support
TF88. . . .yes elissa, I think you are exactly right
RevRandy. . . .for a while I was troubled by thinking back to the night Ericka (Rikkity) left our porch to go out with friends
RevRandy. . . .almost for fear of something happening again ... or my replaying my feelings of powerlessness
RevRandy. . . .until I realized that I was focusing on what I had lost more than what I continue to have
StF. . . .yes, we fear to "re-feel" what we did then
TF88. . . .especially when what we felt then was a complete lack of control
StF. . . .Oh,...(((RevRandy))) great thought!
RevRandy. . . .TF - I suspect that he had some thoughts back then that he would rather not admit to now
Elissa. . . .it's painful and it also requires that we change and we don't like that lol... which leads into my PtoP
RevRandy. . . .but needs to deal with
RevRandy. . . .change - I love change - just not for me
Elissa. . . .i said that randy lol
Elissa. . . . 2,11"Many of the living seem to prefer the past,
Elissa. . . . 2,11and there are 2 reasons and both have to do with change.
Elissa. . . . 2,11Those without a profound loss think it will keep them at bay,
Elissa. . . . 2,11and those living with profound loss think it will keep them from
Elissa. . . . 2,11losing the loved one forever.
Elissa. . . . 2,11"Those who dwell on the Now are also trying to avoid
Elissa. . . . 2,11the awesome and awful reality of loss.
Elissa. . . . 2,11‘I won't think about then, I will focus on now and maybe
Elissa. . . . 2,11meaning will catch up to me.' But here's the clinker:
Elissa. . . . 2,11While we are stuck with the past or fixated with the present,
Elissa. . . . 2,11our loved ones move on and they are no longer past and
Elissa. . . . 2,11they are no longer present.
Elissa. . . . 2,11But in our futures they hold meaning.
Elissa. . . . 2,11That very place many fear going--the future where they think
Elissa. . . . 2,11the loved one has no place--is the very place the loved one is.
Elissa. . . . 2,11For it is there that our meaningful connections
Elissa. . . . 2,11will be manifest again.
Elissa. . . . So don't fear the future.
Elissa. . . . 2,11It is not a place and time of loss and separation.
Elissa. . . . 2,11It is the time and place of connection.
Elissa. . . . 2,11"But that's not the way I, or most others think when alive.
Elissa. . . . 2,11I was as dense as the rest. I worried about Papa dying first.
Elissa. . . . 2,11But it wouldn't have really mattered if I saw him as part of
Elissa. . . . 2,11my future, not just part of my past.
Elissa. . . . And I had to get here
Elissa. . . . 2,11and see him in bathing trunks here to realize that.
Elissa. . . . 2,11O how many will mourn the years lost in pining and grieving
Elissa. . . . 2,11when they get here. Regrets, no... more like ‘duh.'
Elissa. . . . 2,11So that's the scoop." (1/30/2000)
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Elissa. . . .this says to me that trying to stay in the past after a loss
Elissa. . . .or even trying to stay put in the present
Elissa. . . .are ways of avoiding dealing with how we need to move forward.
Elissa. . . .in the beginning of my grief process--and i know it's true for many--
Elissa. . . .i could not even see a future.
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Elissa. . . .it all looked like one big gaping void.
Elissa. . . .my life seemed over, and of course in a way it was.
Elissa. . . .but what rikkity says to me here is: buzzzzzzzz wrong!
Elissa. . . .it's only over if we do not see that our loved ones
Elissa. . . .also grow and change and move forward,
Elissa. . . .and if we don't realise that, both we and they
Elissa. . . .are stuck and going nowhere...
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Elissa. . . .our culture is so focused on the moment and on success...
Elissa. . . .i suspect it is a way of avoiding dealing with loss.
Elissa. . . .so, what do you think about this?
Elissa. . . .hi suwan and journey!
suwan. . . .hi Big E
journey. . . .Hi Elissa and RR and all :)
CHARLIRACE. . . .hello
RevRandy. . . .hi
StF. . . .Such Powerful points, always...
Elissa. . . .welcome charli
CHARLIRACE. . . .loss is important to acknowledge and deal with ... don't you think?
StF. . . .Interesting to me that Rikkity says to look to the future when so much "new" thinking today is to stay in the now...
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RevRandy. . . .the old issue of us thinking about our own changing world, but conceiving of those in spirit as static
Elissa. . . .it's essential, i believe... otherwise we are not dealing with the totality of life
StF. . . .The point is ponderful :)
Elissa. . . .((((((kath)))))) hi!
Elissa. . . .ponderful... i love it! lol
kath. . . .")
kath. . . .hi
suwan. . . .:( oh sure! kath gets hugs!!!
kath. . . .((((suwan)))
CHARLIRACE. . . .(((((((suwan))))))
Elissa. . . .((((((((((((((((((((suwan))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
RevRandy. . . .((((((((((((((((suwan)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
kath. . . .LOL
Elissa. . . .how's that
RevRandy. . . .OK - now go to your corners, and come out hugging
journey. . . .lol
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RevRandy. . . .welcome to all the recent arrivals
Katlin. . . .hi everyone
RevRandy. . . .tonight we are working our way through the favorite points to ponder
RevRandy. . . .that Elissa and I have chosen
* kath gives everyone a Hug! ¸ø Hugs ø¸¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸¸ø Hugs ø¸¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸ Hugs ¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸ Hugs ¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸ Hugs ¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸ Hugs ¸ø¤°`°`°¤ø¸ Hugs ¸ø¤°`°
CHARLIRACE. . . .thank you I feel blessed to have found this room
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Elissa. . . .the thing is that if we don't look toward the future, we won't be able to connect with our loved ones, because that's where they are!!!
StF. . . .avoiding the future by staying in the now, or the past...
StF. . . .Like you said, E, it is important to look at the totality of our life
RevRandy. . . .neither past, present or future are the magic elixir around our losses
Elissa. . . .if we don't, things get distorted
TF88. . . .the present moment won't change unless you are looking/moving forward
Elissa. . . .and we find ourselves in depression like tf's friend,
Elissa. . . .or ill or having accidents... all wake-up calls
TF88. . . .it is by looking forward that we CAN live fully in the present moment
Elissa. . . .we avoid life at our own peril
RevRandy. . . .especially since the past we care about moves on into the future without us if we don't move
journey. . . .i agree tf
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RevRandy. . . .well, let's move on
RevRandy. . . .lol
Elissa. . . .ok
RevRandy. . . . 0,13"Don't reduce your visions to words.
RevRandy. . . . 0,13One of the problems of many people is they feel they have to put words to insights, visions, and feelings.
RevRandy. . . . 0,13And if they do, they reduce the insights, visions, and feelings to words and lose something in the translation.
RevRandy. . . . 0,13So maybe they should be tools, not answers." (5/13/98 - I#25)
RevRandy. . . .from Dimensions of the Spirit
kath. . . .i can relate to that,
RevRandy. . . .So often people, including those of us here,
RevRandy. . . .seem to think we need to reduce spiritual to concrete
RevRandy. . . .that we need to somehow express it to make it real - that experience is not enough
RevRandy. . . .I know, as a minister, I have often tried to put into words what I experience,
RevRandy. . . .and lose something in the process
RevRandy. . . .but when I use those insights to help me craft other images to help others find their own experiences
RevRandy. . . .then they blossom for me as well
journey. . . .i think sometimes the words just cant capture the emotion of some experiences
kath. . . .i know what you mean rev, at times i felt i devalued the experience trying to make it real to some one else
Elissa. . . .me too kath
RevRandy. . . .we can't see the experience for the words
TF88. . . .it's like writing about music...clearly something is lost in the translation :)
RevRandy. . . .yep - know what you mean
kath. . . .but its more like i did not value the experience, the gift of the moment that was mine
RevRandy. . . .so I try to remind myself of this .... that I share what things mean to me, but I don't try to translate the experience itself
kath. . . .yes
Elissa. . . .sometimes i want to share so that i'll remember the experience better--it helps me remember it when i verbalize...
Elissa. . . .but i still lose something of it that can't be expressed in words
RevRandy. . . .and then I find this opens me up to seeing what experiences mean in others and am less focused on what happened, how, etc
Charlirace. . . .the moments that mean the most to me are those that I step back and let happen
TF88. . . .verbalizing it can also help us become more intimate with the experience
kath. . . .some experiences are sacred in a soul language
Charlirace. . . .I agree Kath
journey. . . .agreed tf and deepen the meaning within ourselves, like a realization of the impact it has on us personally
TF88. . . .right journey...it's just our words do not substitute for the experience
Charlirace. . . .nor does thinking about the experience too hard make it more real.... living it is the experience to me
Charlirace. . . .being present
RevRandy. . . .being radically open
kath. . . .yes, a moment of awareness that leads to living in new light/energy
suwan. . . .I think that we each have different ways of experiencing things. To some, verbalization is the most valid, to others, visualization, etc.
Elissa. . . .speaking of experience, let me put my PtoP from that category out now.
RevRandy. . . .OK
Elissa. . . .(Dimensions of the Spirit)
Elissa. . . .it's a long one
Elissa. . . . 0,12"So, look outside. What is that area. Backyard. And if it isn't
Elissa. . . . 0,12there, you never lost it. But you've lost it many times.
Elissa. . . . 0,12But seriously folks... field, web of being; yes,
Elissa. . . . 0,12your backyard is part of that. And so if it isn't there,
Elissa. . . . 0,12it's not in your web.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Too many people look for what they think they lost,
Elissa. . . . 0,12but it was from someone else's web or field.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Your field and another connect, yes.
Elissa. . . . 0,12You hear stories about the other.
Elissa. . . . 0,12That doesn't mean it's in your backyard. It's in theirs.
Elissa. . . . 0,12There is an old story about dogs in Levittown who went crazy
Elissa. . . . 0,12trying to find bones they had buried in look-alike backyards.
Elissa. . . . 0,12"So, when we feel loss we have to be able to know
Elissa. . . . 0,12what we lost; not just what we think we lost.
Elissa. . . . 0,12True, what we think we lost is real in a way,
Elissa. . . . 0,12but being able to so differentiate allows us a
Elissa. . . . 0,12better understanding of ourselves and our field.
Elissa. . . . 0,12As we find out what of our feelings is not us, we also find us.
Elissa. . . . 0,12"Suppose someone is looking to transform their family
Elissa. . . . 0,12into the Cleavers... no, not Eldridge.
Elissa. . . . 0,12They feel they lost out on their childhood.
Elissa. . . . 0,12But hey, there is only one Beaver--and it ain't you, babe.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Everyone gets a childhood, so you can't have lost it.
Elissa. . . . 0,12It might not look like everyone else's, but it's yours.
Elissa. . . . 0,12So, too, with every search for Paradise Lost. Aha.
Elissa. . . . 0,12You never lived in Eden. That's someone else's story.
Elissa. . . . 0,12And this also applies to dreams and hope.
Elissa. . . . 0,12If it isn't yours you can't lose it,
Elissa. . . . 0,12and if it is not yours you can't be it.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Maximize your reality within the field of YOUR being.
Elissa. . . . 0,12And conversely, when others try to load their stuff on you
Elissa. . . . 0,12it is not yours either.
Elissa. . . . 0,12So when someone suggests you've lost it because you mourn
Elissa. . . . 0,12too long, how do they know you've lost it when it wasn't yours
Elissa. . . . 0,12but theirs to begin with. I theeenk thees ees eenough.
Elissa. . . . 0,12"Go back only to find your own roots, not those of others.
Elissa. . . . 0,12And you'll know when you overreach your field.
Elissa. . . . 0,12It will feel foreign, even as you may artificially push toward it.
Elissa. . . . 0,12When someone thinks your field is theirs, probe their
Elissa. . . . 0,12experiential history. If they really lost it they can tell you
Elissa. . . . 0,12about when they had it, and if not... wellll.
Elissa. . . . 0,12To deal with realities--no matter how hard or painful
Elissa. . . . 0,12or seemingly empty--is still better than chasing
Elissa. . . . 0,12dreams, illusions, and chimeras which appear in the
Elissa. . . . 0,12mind's delusions as full and rich and promising;
Elissa. . . . 0,12but which--by their unreality in that life--are but facades
Elissa. . . . 0,12for void, abyss, and nothingness.
Elissa. . . . 0,12For they stand as cardboard faces on realities that aren't yours.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Look behind them and there is not only no backyard of yours,
Elissa. . . . 0,12but--since it is distortion of someone else's backyard--
Elissa. . . . 0,12it's not there, either. You see, it's not real for you.
Elissa. . . . 0,12What you suppose is there is not real for either you or them.
Elissa. . . . 0,12So it is empty. Absolutely empty. Don't go there. Turn back.
Elissa. . . . 0,12Your real pain and loss is infinitely better
Elissa. . . . 0,12than the pain of that emptiness." (2/12/2000)
Elissa. . . .there is soooooo much here,
Elissa. . . .but what speaks loudest to me at the moment is the thought
Elissa. . . .about not being able to lose what we never had to begin with.
Elissa. . . .i used to think i lost my childhood
Charlirace. . . .when facing something that feels foreign ... like losing a child .... it is hard to do anything but freeze
Elissa. . . .because my mother was not accepting or supportive
Elissa. . . .of who i was... and i sometimes have thought
journey. . . .this speaks to me of being uniquely individual and remembering that
Elissa. . . .i lost out on rikkity's physical life,
Elissa. . . .grandchildren i would never have,
Elissa. . . .wedding and graduations and first home i would
Elissa. . . .never get to share in the excitement over, etc., etc.
Elissa. . . .but this says to me that i haven't lost any of that.
Elissa. . . .in fact, that if i focus on what i think i lost
Elissa. . . .that i really did not, i am focusing on emptiness, nothing at all.
Elissa. . . .please go on, charli and journey
Charlirace. . . .sorry
StF. . . .And are missing what you do have..
Elissa. . . .i'm done
Elissa. . . .that's ok :)
journey. . . .sorry too :)
Charlirace. . . .I needed to hear all of what you said
Elissa. . . .no problem, i don't mind being interrupted this way. it means you're relating.
Charlirace. . . .My children are moving out of state with their father
Charlirace. . . .and i am feeling the loss of the moments I won't have
Elissa. . . .o charli, that must be painful
Charlirace. . . .yes, but I don't want to be stuck in pain
Elissa. . . .yes
Charlirace. . . .that is not helping any of us
Charlirace. . . .so your words have special meaning to me
Elissa. . . .i'm glad
RevRandy. . . .but will you have time with them in the future?
Charlirace. . . .sure...not as much as I want....and that is the crux of the pain...
Elissa. . . .deal with your grief but don't feel you're losing what you never had
Charlirace. . . .exactly
RevRandy. . . .so try to focus on the time you will have
Elissa. . . .the grief will be enough to deal with all by itself
Charlirace. . . .thanks.... I will
kath. . . .you can create joy
journey. . . .to me this makes me realize we each have our individual path to experience and that our "backyard" is full of what is meaningful to our growth spiritually, expressed here physically
Elissa. . . .beautifully put, journey
journey. . . .and with purpose to move us forward in a positive manner
RevRandy. . . .journey - right on - it is OUR backyard
TF88. . . .so we are grieving the loss of something we expected to have...not something we actually had that we lost.
Elissa. . . .right
Charlirace. . . .but journey do you ever wonder why your particular journey has to be so hard.... I do
journey. . . .charli, at times yes, but then i try to remember to have faith
suwan. . . .why not?
Charlirace. . . .yes
Elissa. . . .everyone's journey is hard, charli... what matters is how we deal with it
TF88. . . .well charlirace...sometimes I think we make it harder than it really is
Charlirace. . . .I know and finding all of you helps
RevRandy. . . .Most days I think of my life as pretty awesomely good
Elissa. . . .it's a great group that comes here
Charlirace. . . .me too believe it or not, that is why I am so surprised how much this has rocked my center
RevRandy. . . .until someone asks me what I have dealt with in my life
RevRandy. . . .and when I have to list it, I wonder about how I got here whole (or almost)
Elissa. . . .o yes, i can relate to that randy
kath. . . .i know what i had, i am accepting that having had the experience of love with my daughter is wonderful and i am fortunate that, i can look in my backyard and find her love still
StF. . . .But connection to others seems to be a key to healing and moving on
Elissa. . . .support is sooooo important... acceptance is another key
kath. . . .Yes, SIF
journey. . . .(((kath)))
RevRandy. . . .connection to others, appreciation of what we do have, and a sense that on the other side of anything there can be meaning
Charlirace. . . .for me it does help
RevRandy. . . .well, folks, I see by my clock that is it past ten,
RevRandy. . . .so that means time for our break
Elissa. . . .yep yep yep (as hanna would say)
RevRandy. . . .for about 9.46576 minutes

kath. . . .i embrace all that helps Charli
Charlirace. . . .thanks
kath. . . .(((((((((all room))))))))
Elissa. . . .bbbbbrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaakkkkkkkkkkk
reb. . . .I'm trying hard to follow and understand whats being said I only know I miss my son
RevRandy. . . .and then we will come back with the last two sets of Points to Ponder from our choice selection
kath. . . .((((((((reb))))))))))))
kath. . . .i understand
reb. . . .and am trying to live one day at a time
RevRandy. . . .((((((((((((reb))))))))
*** Elissa is now known as Elissabrb
kath. . . .yes reb, one moment at a time
RevRandy. . . .or minute by minute, separated by deep breaths and sighs
StF. . . .Sometimes all you can do is go minute by minute...
kath. . . .yep, still do that
reb. . . .If I only knew for sure he was fine I need more faith and adc site has helped
StF. . . .But know that eventually things WILL be different
Charlirace. . . .that is true... why borrow trouble from future moments
kath. . . .yes, reb
kath. . . .the unknown for us
kath. . . .but not for them, they are our trailblazers
kath. . . .sending us love
Charlirace. . . .nice thought
StF. . . .yes, kath, so true...
kath. . . .it is true charlie
kath. . . .not that we like it in every moment, takes time to acclimate
Charlirace. . . .I feel like I am blocking acceptance
StF. . . .just a little faith is enough, reb, if you hang on...
StF. . . .It will be rewarded
kath. . . .i just know i was lucky to have been loved by my daughter
kath. . . .i can not imagine how shallow i would have remained
StF. . . .ahhh, yes, what love teaches.....
Charlirace. . . .I needed to hear that too
RevRandy. . . .kath - isn't it amazing what we learn through experiences we would have never chosen
kath. . . .she taught so much by her life, i experienced the capacity for unconditional love
kath. . . .knew i had potential, but never could have guessed
StF. . . .amen to that RR
RevRandy. . . .if we open ourselves to the lessons more than the losses
RevRandy. . . .for all those who wonder about their loved one being OK - I do not experience, nor believe them being anything other than OK
kath. . . .agreed
journey. . . .agreed
StF. . . .agreed
Charlirace. . . .agreed
RevRandy. . . .but it is nice to find faith greeted by some assurance, isn't it
kath. . . .we know this, like we know how to breathe
kath. . . .yes it is
StF. . . .so, reb, again, just a Little faith, and it will be rewarded...
journey. . . .it is "huge" to come to the belief that they are ok in spirit, at least it was for me :)
reb. . . .thanks
RevRandy. . . .if the totality of all-that-is is not loving, forgiving, including, what's the point of existence - physical or spiritual
Charlirace. . . .Kath your faith has renewed me
kath. . . .or just remember one hug, one moment of knowing love and hold on to that knowing
*** Elissabrb is now known as Elissa
journey. . . .amen to that RR
kath. . . .wow, charli i am humbled
kath. . . .ty
StF. . . .And the fact that Love Does Exist...says to me...choose love...
RevRandy. . . .that they were (AND ARE) can become enough when we open ourselves, rather than close ourselves
Elissa. . . .kath is so full of love
Charlirace. . . .no I am humbled that I was lost in temporary uncomfortableness when others lessons have been much harder
Elissa. . . .different, charli, not necessarily harder
Charlirace. . . .your sharing has opened me to truth once again
RevRandy. . . .welcome back from break .... but it looks like most of you talked rather than broke - and that's great
StF. . . .Our backyard is ours....
kath. . . .true E
journey. . . .(((((room)))))
RevRandy. . . .let's move on (I am the stern task-master here)
Elissa. . . .ok, rev, rev it up!
StF. . . .yeah, right!
kath. . . .yeah rev
Charlirace. . . .aye aye
RevRandy. . . . 0,6PURPOSE OF LIFE, CONNECTION, and the EVOLUTION OF THE SOUL
RevRandy. . . . 0,6"You keep wanting to know where the road leads;
RevRandy. . . . 0,6but the road only leads somewhere for those in transit, not those in arrival.
RevRandy. . . . 0,6If you found out the ending you'd be there, and where you were would be the end.
RevRandy. . . . 0,6So don't seek that, unless you are ready to stop and let all Creation pass you by on its flow to its evolved self.
RevRandy. . . . 0,6Hint: Fossils know exactly what they are and where they are." (12/30/97 - V#32)
Elissa. . . .rrrrrrrrrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
kath. . . .whew
Elissa. . . .*pant pant
RevRandy. . . .OK - this is such a powerful one for me ....
RevRandy. . . .try to grab hold, and you get left behind
RevRandy. . . .The point of arrival is ahead, not behind
RevRandy. . . .and even standing still means that all races by you.
RevRandy. . . .I am always being AND becoming
RevRandy. . . .So, I want to go with that flow, not against it.
RevRandy. . . .And that means resisting the temptation to find some comfortable place and just stop
RevRandy. . . .call it quits
RevRandy. . . .and that place can be some piece of meaning
RevRandy. . . .or the feelings of loss
RevRandy. . . .or the pain of guilt
RevRandy. . . .or some fear ....
RevRandy. . . .all of those can be stopping points we choose not because they are always good
RevRandy. . . .but because they are familiar
RevRandy. . . .so, be in transit, even as the potential for change is always there
RevRandy. . . .if something isn't changing, then I worry - because maybe what is not changing, not growing, not learning and remembering, is me
RevRandy. . . .But what did this say to you?
StF. . . .Familiar....yes..
StF. . . .makes me think of a very close person to me...
StF. . . .Always seemed stuck...
StF. . . .happy with what is...happy with the past..
StF. . . .But not really interested in creating any future...
StF. . . .I always wondered why....
StF. . . .Maybe something here????
RevRandy. . . .hmmmm
Charlirace. . . .hmmmm
RevRandy. . . .or maybe willing to receive the future second hand
StF. . . .absolutely, but what does that mean???
Elissa. . . .sounds like that person is afraid of change
StF. . . .I honestly cant comprehend it
RevRandy. . . .wants change to be safe (which is oxymoronic)
Charlirace. . . .I am sometimes afraid of change
RevRandy. . . .I think we all are Charlie
Charlirace. . . .those are the moments i lose touch with the divine
Elissa. . . .avoiding something... maybe his/her own feelings
journey. . . .to me it says, embrace it all, including the pain, because there is love with each step, and standing still is really "death", so go with life and flow
StF. . . .Yup, big time...that much I know
Charlirace. . . .journey...so true
Elissa. . . .yes journey! when we stop growing that is the only real death
journey. . . .i get so so much out of these points to ponder, ty E and RR
RevRandy. . . .yes journey - when you go with it you don't choose, because to choose to is opt out of some of it .... which means you opt out
journey. . . .and Rikkity
RevRandy. . . .yw
Charlirace. . . .me too!
Elissa. . . .journey you are most welcome, and you add to our understanding as well
RevRandy. . . .these sessions always open me to new understandings and visions into the points as well
Elissa. . . .let's move on so we don't get stuck lol
RevRandy. . . .so, Elissa - which point did you choose
*** GeorgeFox (ADCjava@***.grid.net) has joined #SpiritualPersistence
Elissa. . . .my next one is very long so bear with me... and it
Elissa. . . .hi george
RevRandy. . . .hi
GeorgeFox. . . .hello elissa
Elissa. . . . 2,13"Let's separate brains from spirit. Take a scalpel.
Elissa. . . . 2,13Pull back the anterior lobe and lop it off. Now you have a
Elissa. . . . 2,13brain working at your speed, Mom :P. But seriously, does
Elissa. . . . 2,13anyone believe that spiritual wholeness is related to
Elissa. . . . 2,13intellect. If so, they can leave now. And boy are they
Elissa. . . . 2,13in for a surprise in a future life. So, we know that the
Elissa. . . . 2,13spirit is neither a product nor a function of the brain.
Elissa. . . . 2,13Then why the hell do we use brains to try to describe spirits.
Elissa. . . . 2,13All we can do is impose the linear thought patterns inherent
Elissa. . . . 2,13in brains on something that is not in the brain.
Elissa. . . . 2,13"There are many concepts that are beyond our thinking, and
Elissa. . . . 2,13to try to think about them with our brains is stupid.
Elissa. . . . 2,13A poor and limited example: Take out an Atlas. Show him
Elissa. . . . 2,13a good time... no no no. But watch out if he shrugs it
Elissa. . . . 2,13all off... aaayyyyeeeeee... Earth as yo-yo. Anymoo, take out
Elissa. . . . 2,13an atlas and find the name of a place you've never heard of.
Elissa. . . . 2,13Try not to notice its country or continent. Ok, now use
Elissa. . . . 2,13your brain to try to describe it... buzzzzz, wrong. If you
Elissa. . . . 2,13have not cognitively experienced it by visit or story or
Elissa. . . . 2,13whatever, you might just as well be guessing. Same with brain
Elissa. . . . 2,13and spirit. And remember, when you've been somewhere and
Elissa. . . . 2,13come home and try to explain it to someone who has never
Elissa. . . . 2,13been there, you can't really do it. So too with brain explanations
Elissa. . . . 2,13of spiritual experiences. And, in fact, you do great violence
Elissa. . . . 2,13to the spiritual essence to try to reduce the sublime to
Elissa. . . . 2,13the mundane. It's like describing God with human attributes;
Elissa. . . . 2,13easy to do but highly demeaning to God, of course, and
Elissa. . . . 2,13highly flattering but inaccurate to humans.
Elissa. . . . 2,13"So hear what people experience and what it means to them,
Elissa. . . . 2,13but don't make the details physical or intellectual. Brains
Elissa. . . . 2,13were made to think, not to feel... in a spiritual way.
Elissa. . . . 2,13So that's that. There is a relationship, not connection.
Elissa. . . . 2,13There are always connections, but that word is too simplistic.
Elissa. . . . 2,13Connections, for most, imply physical--like invisible lines
Elissa. . . . 2,13between them. But what if A is related to B and B is related
Elissa. . . . 2,13to R and T is related to B. Is A connected to T, or just
Elissa. . . . 2,13related one time removed. Ok, here's a quiz. Your brother
Elissa. . . . 2,13has kids. Your kids and his kids are cousins. But his wife's
Elissa. . . . 2,13brother has kids. Are they cousins to your kids. Are they
Elissa. . . . 2,13related without a genetic connection. Yes, if you define family
Elissa. . . . 2,13to include them. Related but not connected. Relationship is
Elissa. . . . 2,13spiritual; connection is physical. And when I first spoke
Elissa. . . . 2,13about connections you were not ready to sense the difference.
Elissa. . . . 2,13"These concepts will continue to expand, for even this is a
Elissa. . . . 2,13poor version of what will be apparent at a greater complexity.
Elissa. . . . 2,13For example, while life seems very diverse on Earth it is
Elissa. . . . 2,13still all based on cellular existence--and I don't mean phones.
Elissa. . . . 2,13But what of life beyond cellular existence. Hey, it's a big
Elissa. . . . 2,13universe out there.
Elissa. . . . 2,13"We use our spirits to understand spirit. Recognize that you
Elissa. . . . 2,13won't get it while you are at this physically-based level.
Elissa. . . . 2,13You are moving there but not there yet. Me neither. Ok, enough.
Elissa. . . . 2,13Look, if you take that atlas place, you know your words don't
Elissa. . . . 2,13do it justice; but if then you say, ‘I will give up on it,'
Elissa. . . . 2,13you will never get there. And know you'd have to start somewhere
Elissa. . . . 2,13and be aimed somewhere. The aim may be inaccurate, but
Elissa. . . . 2,13intra-journey course corrections can be done. You'll never
Elissa. . . . 2,13get to the fork 100 miles down the road unless you start
Elissa. . . . 2,13down the road, see. But but but BUT remember that whatever
Elissa. . . . 2,13symbols or words you use do not contain the essence. In this
Elissa. . . . 2,13spiritual level we always see as through a glass dimly, but
Elissa. . . . 2,13that is true of all spiritual levels until reunion in
Elissa. . . . 2,13All That Is. So, don't give up on trying to express the
Elissa. . . . 2,13inexpressible. It points you in a probable direction;
Elissa. . . . 2,13but don't make those expressions dogma that keep you from
Elissa. . . . 2,13seeing new paths and choices and opportunities along the way.
Elissa. . . . 2,13I would be pissed if someone said, ‘Rikkity has the truth.'
Elissa. . . . 2,13I would be happy if someone said, ‘Rikkity opened me to
Elissa. . . . 2,13my own wider vision.' And since you are losing it, I better go."
Elissa. . . . 2,13(4/15/2000)
Elissa. . . .wow, as someone said to me earlier :)
Elissa. . . .i'll be brief about this one, because i really want to hear your thoughts...
Elissa. . . .it is the next step up in SP land.
Elissa. . . .and what it has meant to me since we received it
Elissa. . . .is a whole new way of looking at and thinking about
Elissa. . . .spiritual reality...
Elissa. . . .no, we can't get it all at this human level,
Elissa. . . .no we can't understand what it's like to be spirit...
Elissa. . . .BUT we can know what it isn't,
Elissa. . . .and by understanding that our physical concepts applied to the spiritual
Elissa. . . .just don't do it justice and we cannot comprehend
Elissa. . . .it that way, THEN we can begin to understand that
Elissa. . . .we need to search in between the physical concepts
Elissa. . . .and try to think about it in a new way.
Elissa. . . .i have begun to try to think about spirit in a new way
Elissa. . . .that i can't really describe (not putting my visions into words) lol
Elissa. . . .but i can stop myself from thinking about it physically... so,
Elissa. . . .for example spirit is not "inside" because
Elissa. . . .inside is a physical concept.
Elissa. . . .and so on... but what does this say to you?
StF. . . .All that Is and spirituality is not intellectual...but experiential....the connection of spirit to spirit
Charlirace. . . .For me it "fits" as I always find spirit moves through me best when I don't interfere with thoughts
Charlirace. . . .when I just allow
Elissa. . . .yes, charli... and allowing can bring us closer to a new vocabulary... one that doesn't even exist yet
Elissa. . . .pretty awesome thought!
StF. . . .And dont sweat the small stuff of physicality...
RevRandy. . . .It bothers me when one discipline, (that is, one way of thinking) is used to try to give credence to another - as if some one system had the lock on truth
Charlirace. . . .I am a teacher
Charlirace. . . .I have been trained to think
Charlirace. . . .and to define
Charlirace. . . .it has not been the "magic" of the connection I have with students...
Charlirace. . . .only spirit to spirit can do that
Charlirace. . . .no words... no defined process
Elissa. . . .yes, that flow of energy when a meaningful connection is made
Charlirace. . . .I feel it here tonight
journey. . . .this speaks to me of deep emotion and love, which to me are not physical or brain (intellect) related, and pushes me to think along those lines when trying to ponder
Elissa. . . .wonderful
journey. . . .just like what you said elissa, about inside being a physical concept
StF. . . .inside, where we tend to define ourselves....
Elissa. . . .journey, i remember that when you first saw this one at a chat you seemed troubled by it... not now :)
StF. . . .very limited..
journey. . . .i pondered this and pondered some more, i feel an understanding about now i lacked then
Elissa. . . .i had a feeling you would
journey. . . .i looked at this as totally linear before
journey. . . .i couldn't find the spirit "essence" at that time
Elissa. . . .as we physical beings do
journey. . . .but what is funny is that
journey. . . .the darn thought wouldn't go away...kept popping in my head again and again
Elissa. . . .lol
Elissa. . . .o gee that's never happened to me
RevRandy. . . .has a way of doing that
journey. . . .then wow, light bulb time
Elissa. . . .may that light bulb keep going on
RevRandy. . . .and get even brighter
StF. . . .ppl try not to feel, and spirit is experiential...feeling...
Charlirace. . . .we are shining now!!!!!!!!!!!
journey. . . .i hope so,..what i have realized from that point and many others here is that there is much more to learn :)
Elissa. . . .always!!!! thank god!
RevRandy. . . .so, let's move on
RevRandy. . . . 0,1RIKKITY's ENTITY and FRIENDS
RevRandy. . . . 0,1"Good morning. I am FS. It is good to be here.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1So, let's say you want to paint a portrait of yourself.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Ha, you don't know how to paint... but say you could. What should it look like.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Hmmm... should it look like you are a dot of being in time and space.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1I think not.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1If you wanted to convey to others who you are, then you would need to include more--
RevRandy. . . . 0,1what and who you have been, and all of your connections across being. You would have to paint the universe;
RevRandy. . . . 0,1because you can't exist separate from it and it can't exist separate from you.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Hmmm... just think of that.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1You and All That Is are intrinsically connected--can't be envisioned separately.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1So when anyone asks you to see someone or something as essentially separate from you, ask them how that is possible.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1How can they be part of this reality and be separate.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Can't do it.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Hmmm... ponder that.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1Can't be.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1You and all else are essentially and intrinsically connected.
RevRandy. . . . 0,1And I think you get the picture, hahahahahaha. Bye." (9/3/99 - W#147)
Charlirace. . . .geez
RevRandy. . . .I like this one for its message of connection
RevRandy. . . .so often we are presented with a world view of separation -
RevRandy. . . .individuals
RevRandy. . . .separate
RevRandy. . . .even a God who is separate
RevRandy. . . .but here is a vision of it all being part of a single unity
RevRandy. . . .different qualities, but all of one
RevRandy. . . .And this has led me to look at others very differently
RevRandy. . . .I know try to see what it is that I have in common with them
RevRandy. . . .I try to see past the irritations (not always easy) to see our bonds
RevRandy. . . .Because if I deny their bonds to me, I, in effect, deny part of myself, their part in my web of being
RevRandy. . . .And also I like the notion of having my place in the universe, and I can't exist without it,
RevRandy. . . .and it can't be universal without me.
RevRandy. . . .But what about for you?
journey. . . .I like this because it feels like a big bump to the ego.
Elissa. . . .crash lol
journey. . . .lol
StF. . . .Religions that separate! That is a big one! Incomprehensible!
*** deezee (dzogg@***.tgn.net) has joined #SpiritualPersistence
RevRandy. . . .journey - but in an interesting way - by seeing beyond our egos we get a greater sense of self
RevRandy. . . .Yep - religious make a religion out of separating people
Charlirace. . . .I like this because I always wanted to believe I was equal to all and all were equal to me
Elissa. . . .not what religion is supposed to be about is it, stf!
Elissa. . . .hi deezee :)
deezee. . . .hi elissa
Charlirace. . . .that is why I no longer go to church
journey. . . .when i look at the homeless person on the street, i would think "I am above them, better somehow", but
journey. . . .coming to understand this, i realize, we are connected and how dare I presume to think that..it could be me in that position instead of them
StF. . . .And I, too, like RR try to see where we are the same..
StF. . . .and I think this is something that needs to be taught more to ppl today
StF. . . .Celebrate the differences...but see the likeness
Charlirace. . . .so many I know are angry with me for caring so much about those they think are "unworthy"
Elissa. . . .yes yes yes
RevRandy. . . .yep - you got it
RevRandy. . . .but they are us
Charlirace. . . .I have the right to respect and love all
Charlirace. . . .yes
RevRandy. . . .and the responsibility to do so
RevRandy. . . .to them and to your self
Elissa. . . .we so often define ourselves by how much we own or what job we have and we say that we have things because we deserve them and others don't... ha
Elissa. . . .that's just a rationalization that keeps us from caring about others' lives
Elissa. . . .and a denial of our connection
StF. . . .And love of others begins with love of self...because we are all related
Charlirace. . . .we all are homeless and hungry when one of us is homeless and hungry
journey. . . .agreed elissa, somehow we dont want to feel that connection and it is painful to look at the truth of that
RevRandy. . . .so, elissa, what's your point to ponder?
Elissa. . . .so, let me tell you a bit about my next, and our last point to ponder.
Elissa. . . .this one is very special to me, both for what it says
Elissa. . . .and for how it came to be.
Elissa. . . .it was at a chat session on Jesus,
Elissa. . . .and i hadn't intended to do any channeling that night
Elissa. . . .but as so often happens lol
Elissa. . . .i was surprised!
Elissa. . . .and no, it wasn't Jesus,
Elissa. . . .but someone who knew him. and through her spiritual eyes
Elissa. . . .i got to see him.
Elissa. . . .it was a moving and incredibly enlightening experience for me,
Elissa. . . .and i hope some of that communicates itself to you.
Elissa. . . .so, here goes...
Elissa. . . . 0,1GH at a chat session on Jesus:
Elissa. . . . 0,1"Good friends, it is a wonder to me to be with you tonight...
Elissa. . . . 0,1and on very short notice, I might add. Good evening to all of you.
Elissa. . . . 0,1I have come to speak with you about the man you call Jesus.
Elissa. . . . 0,1Our name for him was slightly different, but that really
Elissa. . . . 0,1doesn't matter at all. It doesn't matter what his name is
Elissa. . . . 0,1or what he looked like (although I can tell you that he was
Elissa. . . . 0,1not blond-haired and blue-eyed and he did not look at all
Elissa. . . . 0,1like a simpering victim!). It does not matter what he wore or
Elissa. . . . 0,1what he ate or where he lived or how he died. His message,
Elissa. . . . 0,1that o so simple message, was his power and his glory
Elissa. . . . 0,1and our own. If only everyone had heard that.
Elissa. . . . 0,1"I will tell a little bit about what I know.
Elissa. . . . 0,1This was a man whose pores breathed his energy.
Elissa. . . . 0,1He had no halo following him around, but his energy
Elissa. . . . 0,1was a glow around him. You touched him and you felt that he
Elissa. . . . 0,1was more alive, more physical, more himself, than anyone you
Elissa. . . . 0,1had known or ever would. It was a palpable feeling that
Elissa. . . . 0,1came across even if he had not spoken one single word.
Elissa. . . . 0,1He was the living, breathing image of his message and he
Elissa. . . . 0,1taught all of us who would listen that we could be
Elissa. . . . 0,1just like him... maybe not now, but some time. And more
Elissa. . . . 0,1than that, he taught us who we were. This man could talk
Elissa. . . . 0,1to you for 5 minutes and know your soul--know who you were
Elissa. . . . 0,1and who you could be and who you would be. He was whole,
Elissa. . . . 0,1and he was complete, and that allowed him to see what that
Elissa. . . . 0,1would mean for others. Some thought he could tell the future,
Elissa. . . . 0,1but no, he could tell who you were and he could love
Elissa. . . . 0,1who you were; and through his love for us, we began
Elissa. . . . 0,1to understand that we could love ourselves.
Elissa. . . . 0,1He saw the queen in the Magdalen and the child,
Elissa. . . . 0,1faithful but with much growing to do, in his mother,
Elissa. . . . 0,1and the philosopher in me though I was but a poor peasant mother.
Elissa. . . . 0,1And that is why we loved him. Being next to him was
Elissa. . . . 0,1almost like an addiction. It made you feel GOOD about yourself!
Elissa. . . . 0,1And so the crowds came to feel good about themselves but
Elissa. . . . 0,1they said it was him and he said 'no, the kingdom of heaven
Elissa. . . . 0,1is within you!' But they could not hear it, most of them
Elissa. . . . 0,1could not believe it.
Elissa. . . . 0,1"But what I came to tell you is this:
Elissa. . . . 0,1this was a man who was whole as we all will be. He did not
Elissa. . . . 0,1perform miracles of physical reality, he performed miracles
Elissa. . . . 0,1of spiritual reality. The loaves and fishes were sufficient
Elissa. . . . 0,1for the masses because being in Jesus's presence made them
Elissa. . . . 0,1feel the abundance of who they were. What more did they then
Elissa. . . . 0,1need. What more do any of us need. You see, the story--
Elissa. . . . 0,1the way--was there in his words and in his being. Was he
Elissa. . . . 0,1disappointed that things went so wrong? Yes and no.
Elissa. . . . 0,1Of course he would have had it differently, but he also
Elissa. . . . 0,1understood that it would have to be that way. He never once
Elissa. . . . 0,1felt deserted by God or a failure.
Elissa. . . . 0,1"Well, this was supposed to be a short visit,
Elissa. . . . 0,1so I will take my leave now. Thank you for listening
Elissa. . . . 0,1so intently. I hope I have given something valuable
Elissa. . . . 0,1to remember. Goodnight." (8/1/99 - W#142)
Elissa. . . .Jesus showed us the way, not by his words
Elissa. . . .but by who he was... his life was the example
Elissa. . . .and the hope for all of us.
Elissa. . . .and we focused--and focus--on his death.
Elissa. . . .the message we hear now is not the message that was meant to be communicated.
Elissa. . . .it was about love, not suffering or death or sin.
Elissa. . . .so, your thoughts
StF. . . .Yes, that has come to be my understanding of Jesus....Jesus was a man who exemplified the "Christ" spirit... His message was NOT about death...not about Crucifixion, but about Life, living, RESURRECTION!
StF. . . .The Christ spirit dwells within us all, waiting for us to realize it
RevRandy. . . .Christ spirit, Buddha spirit,
Charlirace. . . .about BEING now ...about living completely .... about love
journey. . . .it is a message of hope to me
Elissa. . . .talk about intra-journey course corrections!
Charlirace. . . .I am glad you said that Rev
StF. . . .Well, Christ is a title, not a name....
StF. . . .The Christ...the Way...the Messenger..
Elissa. . . .it's just a word, so let's not focus there
RevRandy. . . .I know - and I think of Jesus as a Buddha and Buddha as a Christ
Charlirace. . . .me too
RevRandy. . . .And what a type of spirit
Charlirace. . . .doesn't always go over too well in conversations though
journey. . . .a physical example that we can be who we are in the physical
RevRandy. . . .yes!
Elissa. . . .it's about us
StF. . . .yes, that Buddha, Christ...said we can be
RevRandy. . . .about our lives
StF. . . .The message of love
Charlirace. . . .about being love
StF. . . .Of knowing Who we are
StF. . . .And who we are does not lie in any "ism"
Charlirace. . . .we....inclusive
RevRandy. . . .isms restrict
journey. . . .there is a feeling of such freedom when reading that
Elissa. . . .i'm so glad that comes through, because for me it felt liberating
RevRandy. . . .when I first experienced it, I just thought "ahhhh"
Elissa. . . .and joyous
Charlirace. . . .and affirming
Elissa. . . .o yes
StF. . . .Which is why I do say I am Christian...because being Christian is taking a bum rap in these later generations :)
StF. . . .But to me, being Christian, means being LOVE
Charlirace. . . .my fiancee does not see me as a christian
Charlirace. . . .he is a catholic
Charlirace. . . .and sees me as.... out there
StF. . . .well, that's an "ism"
RevRandy. . . .the institutions fail to express the essence, because they reduce the experience to words, acts, and rituals
Charlirace. . . .yes, I agree STF
Elissa. . . .Jesus, Buddha, etc. do not belong to a religion... their religions were created by others
StF. . . .Yes, lets just BE
Charlirace. . . .ok... be
RevRandy. . . .Well, dear folks, it is 11 pm on the east coast (and here in Virginia's Tidewater we are in the midst of a raging storm)
RevRandy. . . .so it time for us to go our ways
RevRandy. . . .thankful for being together once again.
Charlirace. . . .peace be with you
StF. . . .awwww....okay....
RevRandy. . . .peace be with all of you
Elissa. . . .thank you all for being here... it has felt warm and loving tonight :)
journey. . . .thank you Rev and Elissa!
RevRandy. . . .and thank you all
StF. . . .Blessings....and God's Peace
Charlirace. . . .thanks for all you have given to me tonight
StF. . . .and thank you all!
RevRandy. . . .be well this week
* Playing txplay20.mrc to #SpiritualPersistence with 50ms delay
Elissa. . . . 0,14!Elissa rainbow.mid 14,0 :o)
Charlirace. . . .(((((((room)))))))))
journey. . . .Bless you both and Rikkity too!
Elissa. . . .((((((((SP)))))))))))))))
suwan. . . .night all
journey. . . .nite suwan
Elissa. . . .thank you journey, and love to all of you!
journey. . . .I am heading out too, had big day today, goodnite and God Bless everyone, all ways!
deezee. . . .nite j see ya
RevRandy. . . .nite
aud. . . .just wanted to wish you well
aud. . . .nite
Elissa. . . .thank you, we wish you well, too
aud. . . .thanks Elissa
Elissa. . . .goodnight
Session Close: Sun May 28 23:08:03 2000