log081300

Session Start: Sun Aug 13 20:40:46 2000
*** Now talking in #SpiritualPersistence
*** Topic is ' 2,4~ Next 2,7Topic: 2,8"Energy, Addiction, and Racism" 2,9Sunday 2,11August 13 0,12at 9pm 2,13EDT ~ 0,2Hosted by Rev. Dr. Randolph Becker & Elissa Bishop Becker (and Rikkity). URL: www.spiritualpersistence.com '

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RevRandy so, can we start
Deni hi everyone :)
Elissa no one's new so i can't do my new part of our intro
Elissa maybe i'll do it anyway lol
NancyM lol
Deni go for it Lissa!!
fang go ahead elissa
RevRandy make up some new history
* NancyM volunteers 2 b new
Elissa ok, just a new line for moi :)
Elissa lol nancy
fang i'll be new too
RevRandy RevRandy is a dog trainer in Saskatoon, and Elissa is the Director of training for General Hospital
Elissa ok now i'll have to make up a whole new intro lol... that'll be for next time
fang i'd love to be new, and no problems lol
Elissa here's my new sentence: I am a writer, medium, and counselor with
Elissa a Masters degree (M.Ed.) in Community Counseling.
RevRandy YAY!
fang yea elissa
Carol Yea!!
RevRandy that's for real --
Elissa yes folks, i really did it!
NancyM way kewl
fang elissa gets a handful of gold stars, for being a star
Deni wild applause for Ellisa!!!!!!!!!!!
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* Elissa prances around the room singing "i feel pretty"
RevRandy hey blue
Deni hi bluelight!!!!
fang good for you dear you should
Elissa thank you all
bluelight hi guyz :D
TF88 12Hip Hip Hurray Elissa!
Elissa but enough of me
Elissa hey ((((((blue))))))
RevRandy So, with Master Elissa in the house, we can begin
RevRandy as always, we begin with our simple invocation
RevRandy May we be connected to all things loving
RevRandy Protected from all things evil
RevRandy and guided in all ways gracious. Amen
NancyM Amen
Elissa amen~
Carol Amen
TF88 peace
fang amen
fang a women lol
bluelight amen
Elissa lol
Deni amen
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Elissa ((((((suwan))))))
Deni hi Suwan!
suwan hi everyone including deni
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Deni :)
RevRandy here we have an opening thought for the week from Rikkity
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RevRandy 0,2"All dysfunction is about energy; and chronic dysfunction is addiction to
RevRandy 0,2some form of energy-- hate, booze, drugs, violence, religion, and sports...
RevRandy 0,2not to mention dogs... rrrrr. It could be anything external to one. Some are
RevRandy 0,2addicted to running and some are addicted to sunning... music, cigarettes,
RevRandy 0,2fruit punch, peanut butter, applause, quiet. The substance doesn't matter as
RevRandy 0,2much, but some also have a physical claim as well." (8/9/2000)
RevRandy OK - what do you see in this?
bluelight worshiping things that keep us away from our path?
fang that you think i'm dysfunctional
TF88 trying to use something external to fulfill what is really an internal need
Elissa what are you addicted to, by this definition?
RevRandy why fang?
NancyM distractions
bluelight LOL fang
fang because of my dogs
RevRandy that was a reference to a certain dog
fang i would die for my dogs
Elissa we're all at least a little dysfunctional
fang well i'm the queen of it
bluelight my dogs r spirit gifts from Spirit ahem
bluelight :D
fang ty blue
RevRandy I want to go back to that comment from TF, about something external
* Elissa places the crown with the big "D" on fangs head
bluelight :) fang
RevRandy TF - want to say any more
TF88 well, using something outside of oneself to supply energy....the energy is not lasting
TF88 whereas creating it inside, it's permanent
bluelight is the key here 'moderation in all things'?
RevRandy one could be moderately addicted to things?
fang fang has been an addict way back
NancyM or addicted to moderation ? lol
RevRandy so, it may be the issue of whether we see or experience ourselves as creators of energy, or users of energy
Elissa lol good one nancy
fang can you teach the inside stuff
bluelight we can't stop feeding them tho
fang or is fang hopeless
RevRandy can you teach it .... a good question, and also, can you learn it?
* NancyM is choosing creator
Elissa maybe you can guide it, rather than teach it
fang so are you meaning we have to give up, all that i live for????
RevRandy Well, tonight we have perspectives from three guests that Rikkity brought to us
NancyM kewl
Elissa no fang, only recognize where your energy is coming from and going to
RevRandy if we are aware of what is happening, then it is a different matter
Elissa hopefully :)
RevRandy yes, the potential is there for a different scenario
NancyM i agree
RevRandy so, let's hear from one of the visitors I talked with last week
RevRandy 2,14TJ:
RevRandy 2,14
RevRandy 2,14"Hello, dear friends. People think of me in politics; but I also read much
RevRandy 2,14in sciences, and my friend Ben helped me. There will always be a flow from
RevRandy 2,14more to less--water, air, electricity, and energy in general. But we must
RevRandy 2,14remember that we are thoughtful and decisive beings, and that which is a law
RevRandy 2,14of nature need not be a law of human habit. So when someone who is lacking
RevRandy 2,14personal energy tries to get you to give some you have a choice. For
RevRandy 2,14 2,14example, Cyrano didn't have the energy to speak for himself; but if you were
RevRandy 2,14to speak for him, it would enervate you but not energize him. Aha.
RevRandy 2
bluelight i even looked up 'enervate' last nite !!!
bluelight sheesh didn't know there was a word like that
Elissa good for you blue!
bluelight :D
Deni so fill us in Blue :)
bluelight it means it took energy away from the guy who gave him the words
bluelight i hope i'm right :0
RevRandy yep
Elissa clap clap clap
RevRandy right
bluelight MAJOR WHEW!!
Elissa lol
RevRandy TJ has more to say, but let's look at this first
RevRandy Let's talk about this concept of enervating the other .... or what happens when we are the other
Jackie so your choice is to give or not to give?
Elissa yes
bluelight yes
RevRandy aware of the consequences
RevRandy but note the twist on this ... you could give energy, not have it for yourself, and it would still not energize the other person
Elissa when we need energy we sometimes try to get others to give it to us
RevRandy when someone spoke for Cyrano, it did not help Cyrano speak
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TF88 so there is a difference between it being taken from you and your giving it...the second one meaning we are aware and made a choice?
RevRandy hello Zee
NancyM not to deny another of their own experience ?
Elissa hi zee :)
RevRandy TF - yes ... but we also need to be aware of why we are feeding into that pattern
bluelight i think i'll not help another woman win a guy with my words.. i'll think i'll just take the guy HAHAHA
TF88 right
NancyM lol
Zee hello everyone
Jackie codependent?
Elissa are we truly giving someone energy, or are we throwing it into a void that we cannot fill
NancyM hmmmmmmmm
RevRandy having been there myself, many times, thinking that I would have the magic energy that would bring the other person around, I know how I gave it ... and why, probably to feel competent and powerful myself
Elissa codependency is very close to this, jackie
bluelight o u mean just helping anyone RevR?
RevRandy well, it could be I gave away energy (or what I took as my energy) as a way to validate my own energy
NancyM isn't just helping different than this ?
Jackie this is like teaching someone to help him/herself versus doing something for him/her. If taught, then they can help themselves, but if just given, it is used up and gone
Elissa one question to ask ourselves is 'will my help empower the other person or make them dependent on me?'
RevRandy helping is one thing, when it is occasional, incident ... but when it becomes patterned, chronic,
bluelight i have tried to teach tho and still went down empty tube
NancyM like u fell down n I helped u up... literally
Elissa right, what jackie said lol
bluelight but i finally said Whoa!
RevRandy will the energy given change the equation, or will it stay the same ....
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Elissa hi leigh
RevRandy look - pumping air into an inner tube that has a leak exhausts the one doing the pumping but never fills the tube
NancyM depends on the intention to me
leigh hello
bluelight i make the mistake of thinking since time has passed that things have changed and my energy will b accepted
Deni great analogy
Jackie I see that RR
NancyM thaz truth rev
bluelight i like that RR
Elissa nancy, the intention is only on your part... you need to take the other person into account as well
RevRandy now, if you want to find the leak, and then patch it, pumping in some air will help
bluelight but u can't fix another person's leak
Elissa blue, that's what we call repeating the same behavior and hoping for a different outcome lol
RevRandy but maybe the tube didn't want to be a tube, just a piece of flat rubber, and it was our desire to see it all blown up
NancyM yes but if I fell down {literally} n u helped me stand up elissa
Jackie yes, and how do we "helpers" tell the difference
bluelight that's a new idea .. tube didn't want to b blown up
Jackie we try first?
NancyM Isnt it in the intention of the help
Elissa that would only help if you could stand on your own eventually, nancy
RevRandy NancyM, what if you come to expect that someone will help you stand up, so you give up on trying to do it for yourself
Jackie ah
Elissa if you kept falling down, then i wouldn't be helping you and i would be exhausting myself
NancyM ok
Jackie so tough love is the answer?
Elissa not tough, just realistic i think
Deni it's difficult to find that fine line between helping and enabling.....it's easier if you can have an objective look
RevRandy this is some tricky stuff, because neither side of the picture is likely to be absolutely clear
Elissa it's very hard, deni... takes a lot of thought sometimes to sort it out
RevRandy am I helping, or facilitating? are they using or growing?
fang i think supportive love is better, imho
Elissa i think so, fang
fang tough love has killed alot of addicts
RevRandy and I think there are some tests we can apply to know if we are just being used (and allowing ourselves to be used) or not?
fang but most people don't care
Jackie such as?
Elissa yes fang
NancyM isnt it ALL a choice tho ?
Jackie repetitive patterns, no change
RevRandy hey - let's hear what TJ went on to say
RevRandy 2,0This is the way and the test. Let's say you have a thing you call a light
RevRandy 2,0bulb... I hope I get this right... wait, let me try it my way. You have a
RevRandy 2,0candle which lights your bedchamber. And then someone fumbling in a dark
RevRandy 2,0cavern calls to you, and you take your light there. Your chamber is dark;
RevRandy 2,0and also it is not enough light to light the cavern, so it is lost. Only if
RevRandy 2,0you add energy to energy is there a gain. If your candle had been added to
RevRandy 2,0one there already, the scene might have become bright enough. So a test: Do
RevRandy 2,0you add your energy to a lack of energy and lose it, or do you add your
RevRandy 2,0energy to energy and benefit from the sum. Look deeply and truly at what the
RevRandy 2,0energy asked for is." (8/11/2000)
fang it's always a choice for both parties
RevRandy does this help us see the situation more clearly?
fang i think addiction can also be genetic, like obesity
Elissa we don't always recognize it as a choice... it may also be a real need--just not one that can be filled by anyone or anything external
Elissa definitely fang
bluelight but this requires judging another person doesn't it RevRandy?
Jackie actually, I have worked on some committees like this, some are problem solvers and work, and others are just a total drain with no one being satisfied. Those I have left.
RevRandy judging ... or asking whether it seems they are offering energy into the equation
fang well looking into my family tree, there was alot of alcoholism, addictive behavior
bluelight good idea
Elissa alcoholism is definitely genetic through the father
NancyM ditto fang but i choose differently
RevRandy I don't think it takes too much awareness to sense if this is going to be a shared energy project, or just a one-way street
bluelight that's a theory Elissa not definite isn't it?
Elissa it has been validated by research blue
fang well it was on both sides of my family
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RevRandy so, if we have an artificially produced child from the genetic material of two women, less likelihood of addiction?
bluelight it happened in mine i know
Elissa 2 women can produce a child?
Elissa nevermind
fang lol
RevRandy anymoo
RevRandy back to TJ
suwan well, some religions believe in anything don't they
bluelight hmmm
RevRandy his criterion is for there to be energy added to energy, not to deficit
Elissa lol suwan
bluelight {-- lost
RevRandy -----}. you are here
Elissa suwan will find you
NancyM ditto blue
bluelight i'm always getting lost tho lol
bluelight just run it by me one more time maybe i'll get it
RevRandy if you give, you should see something more than you gave in the outcome
TF88 I think it's important to remember that "vices" are not the only addictions
Elissa o yes tf
RevRandy addictions may be vices, but not all addictions are the classic vices
TF88 some people are addicted to fighting, bickering, criticising...behavior like that
bluelight right TF sometimes it's only solitaire (giggle)
RevRandy some people are addicted to mIRC
suwan my mother in law was addicted to complaining
Elissa lol
NancyM lol
Elissa sounds like my mother
NancyM sounds familiar
TF88 I think some of these behavioral addictions are the hardest to see in ourselves
RevRandy it is not a question of the content of the addiction, but the fact that the addiction whatever it is takes in energy without adding anything to it
Elissa very true tf!
RevRandy TF - I know what you mean - people who say "What? I am just being myself!" with no awareness of what they are doing
bluelight i think distractions r sometimes caused by fear ?
fang what i'm just being myself ;) lol
Elissa lol
RevRandy Well, before we move into our break, I want to share another PtoP from this week's conversations
bluelight NO EXCUSE FANG!!!!
RevRandy for you to Ponder, while we break
bluelight lol
RevRandy 11,12WT:
RevRandy 11,12
RevRandy 11,12"I was an addict. I am an addict, who is trying to be honest about my
RevRandy 11,12addictions. When I started using, there was very little of me. I felt very
RevRandy 11,12small. And powerless. I thought the drugs gave me what I didn't have. They
RevRandy 11,12made me feel good and I thought they made me feel good about myself. There's
RevRandy 11,12a big difference there.
RevRandy 11,12
RevRandy 11,12"Over time, even the drugs could not make up for what I thought was missing
RevRandy 11,12from inside me. They were all external. They gave something, but added
RevRandy 11,12nothing. And as the gracious gentleman said, if you add something into a
RevRandy 11,12vast hole it is swallowed up. I began my trip out of there by not dealing
RevRandy 11,12with the drugs, but by trying to find me. And when I could no longer see me
RevRandy 11,12because of the drugs, I decided I needed help with the drugs. But what
RevRandy 11,12brought me recovery was not to end the drugs, but to start finding me. And
RevRandy 11,12then I saw the equation reverse and what I had and was and did would get
RevRandy 11,12lost in the void of drugs. I had to stay away from them if the meager little
RevRandy 11,12sense of myself was not going to be swallowed up by their awful darkness.
RevRandy 11,12The only equations in all of life are those with both sides positive.

RevRandy 11,12"Remember from algebra, if the 2 sides of an equation are out of balance
RevRandy 11,12because one side is negative, you can add the same quantity to both sides
RevRandy 11,12and it will appear as if the equation no longer has any deficits; but,
RevRandy 11,12actually, the inequality always remains the same no matter how much more you
RevRandy 11,12put into both sides. An infinite addition to both sides still has one side
RevRandy 11,12less than the other. I think you get the picture and don't need my candle to
RevRandy 11,12show it, haha. Bye." (8/11/2000)
bluelight not sure i'll have that beer after class tonite :( U RUINED IT FOR ME sniff
RevRandy Ponder that ... keep on talking, and we will be back in about 10 minutes to talk about it together.
RevRandy it's ok blue, if you know you can survive without it
Elissa good blue :P
Deni oh blue...have the beer...lol
bluelight not sure of anything RR LOLOL
Elissa bbbbbbbbrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaakkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
fang do you want the beer or need the beer?
bluelight yyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy hehhee
bluelight ummmmmm i'll try to figure that one during break fang LOL
*** Elissa is now known as Elissabrb
fang i was going to say after tonight you may need it lol
bluelight i am trying to break my addiction to my computer
Deni GOOD LUCK!!
Deni lol
TF88 lol
RevRandy what addiction .... wait, don't pick up that phone ...... leave my modem alone
bluelight what if i stop coming here to break my addiction :0
bluelight lolol
Deni noooooooooooooooooooooo
TF88 well...that would only be fitting blue if you were not gaining something lasting here ;)
bluelight very true TF and i do.. good way to measure
suwan believe me I have some lasting stuff from my ice cream addiction
TF88 :)
RevRandy also, if you only came here to get, and not to give ... but we all share so much with each other
bluelight i find i avoid things i really need (and want) to do .. that's another addiction
bluelight i kid a lot RevRandy & E but i LOVE tonite's topic .. i need it so much
*** Elissabrb is now known as Elissa
RevRandy and so let's get back together, and I will run the PtoP again, so we can get into it
bluelight i can understand everything better when it's put in terms of energy
RevRandy 11,12"I was an addict. I am an addict, who is trying to be honest about my
RevRandy 11,12addictions. When I started using, there was very little of me. I felt very
RevRandy 11,12small. And powerless. I thought the drugs gave me what I didn't have. They
RevRandy 11,12made me feel good and I thought they made me feel good about myself. There's
RevRandy 11,12a big difference there.
RevRandy 11,12
RevRandy 11,12"Over time, even the drugs could not make up for what I thought was missing
RevRandy 11,12from inside me. They were all external. They gave something, but added
RevRandy 11,12nothing. And as the gracious gentleman said, if you add something into a
RevRandy 11,12vast hole it is swallowed up. I began my trip out of there by not dealing
RevRandy 11,12with the drugs, but by trying to find me. And when I could no longer see me
RevRandy 11,12because of the drugs, I decided I needed help with the drugs. But what
RevRandy 11,12brought me recovery was not to end the drugs, but to start finding me. And
RevRandy 11,12then I saw the equation reverse and what I had and was and did would get
RevRandy 11,12lost in the void of drugs. I had to stay away from them if the meager little
RevRandy 11,12sense of myself was not going to be swallowed up by their awful darkness.
RevRandy 11,12The only equations in all of life are those with both sides positive.

RevRandy 11,12"Remember from algebra, if the 2 sides of an equation are out of balance
RevRandy 11,12because one side is negative, you can add the same quantity to both sides
RevRandy 11,12and it will appear as if the equation no longer has any deficits; but,
RevRandy 11,12actually, the inequality always remains the same no matter how much more you
RevRandy 11,12put into both sides. An infinite addition to both sides still has one side
RevRandy 11,12less than the other. I think you get the picture and don't need my candle to
RevRandy 11,12show it, haha. Bye." (8/11/2000)
Elissa "what brought me recovery was not to end the drugs, but to start finding me."
Elissa and no one can find "you" except you
NancyM amen
Elissa we cannot do that for anyone else... although we can help
Elissa through love and support
RevRandy help, support, assist, maybe ... but not do
RevRandy This passage also reminded me about balance of energy exchange too
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bluelight i like that algebra example
TF88 would you please give me an example of how the equation stuff fits into one's life?
RevRandy in that part about the inequality
RevRandy OK -
Elissa so is that tough love? i don't think so... tough love seems to imply we know what the other person needs, doesn't it?
RevRandy let me try
TF88 I understand the equation, itself, but not how it applies
RevRandy you and someone else are in an unequal state of relationship .... they being less aware of self
RevRandy and perhaps they, or perhaps you, like that ratio or relationship
RevRandy so no matter how much you add to the overall equation, it still ends up being unequal by the same degree
TF88 ok...now I see...I didn't realize it was talking about 2 people...i thought just one.
RevRandy I will be concrete
RevRandy I have had some teachers who tried to run their classes not with the end being that the teacher and the student would end up at the same level ....
Elissa the 2 sides can also mean 1 person plus their addiction, i think
Elissa go on, randy
RevRandy say some more
Elissa some more :)
RevRandy how would that work out?
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Elissa let's ponder that
RevRandy is this like the binge drinker who claims to be making progress by only having two drinks, but having them every night .... so the relationship is still addictive?
Elissa hi tammy
* tammy : Hello everyone!
RevRandy hi tammy
suwan don't you think that often the person who is addicted is not the one who wants the change
RevRandy hmmmm, suwan
Elissa well, perhaps it's like trying to add more and more to the addiction hoping for a balance
NancyM to me thaz like ... but I only smoke 2 cigs a day I'm not a "smoker"
Elissa so you drink more or run faster, etc. hoping that you will come to a balance
Elissa but the deficit is always there
NancyM ic
RevRandy that sounds like the classic anorexia pattern -- eat less to get even slimmer
Elissa i'm pondering this as i type lol... this is brand new stuff for us too
RevRandy but NancyM, I agree with your point ... the use of some outside measure about what remains an addictive pattern
Elissa yes, suwan... the addicted person usually is trying to avoid changing
Elissa addicts are often terrified of change
NancyM i say smokin is smokin 1 or 100
NancyM thaz all
TF88 or their energy is so temporary that trying to make a change is overwhelming
RevRandy AA would say the same about alcohol -- for the alcoholic, one drink is the problem
NancyM but its your choice to decide
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NancyM {{{{{{{WT}}}}}}}
Elissa ok, but how do you come to recognize it as your choice?
bluelight wish we could talk about addictions that rn't drug related
WhiteTiger nancy :)
RevRandy there is a perception of changing "happpening" to one, while in fact change takes energy, which many people don't have
Elissa hey wt!!!
RevRandy the tiger is here
WhiteTiger hiya Elissa :)
suwan A friend visited last week and was complaining about her husband's drinking, as we talked it became apparent that he wasn't worried about it she was addicted to whining about his drinking
Elissa what kind would you like to talk about blue?
NancyM Woa..... just at some point i realized I made all my choices ?
Elissa very typical, suwan... and if he really did stop she probably would be as terrified as him
bluelight avoiding
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RevRandy hello michael

michael hello all
RevRandy So, this piece we are pondering, suggests that a lot of energy can often go into maintain the relationship as it is
TF88 now why is it so much easier to see other people's addictions than our own!
Elissa good question tf!
NancyM Good Q
bluelight i c my own .. is why i need that beer HEHEHE just kidding but i do c mine all the time
Elissa then you are more insightful than most of us blue
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Elissa hey ((((((O))))))
RevRandy in an addiction, we often do not possess the internal energy to be able to see clearly
TF88 hey there O
Ocallah (((((((Elissa)))))))))
bluelight but i'm not any closer to getting rid of it tho E
WhiteTiger part of addiction is deliberate blindness to the self destructive behavior.. easier to se it when ya aren't hiding it from yerself and others
NancyM agree wt
michael can chronic negative thinking be considered an addiction?
Elissa part of addiction, michael
bluelight michael that so easily creeps up on me after i've been soooo positive :0
WhiteTiger boils down to as long as ya use a crutch, yer stuck with the limp
Elissa blue, recognizing it is the first step
Ocallah no mistake me being here ;)
Elissa or as long as you limp you'll need the crutch?
bluelight {--- needs help taking baby steps :0
TF88 even better E
WhiteTiger naw... a limp don't call for a crutch... willpower will do nicely :)
Ocallah it's not about will power at all
WhiteTiger yes it is, imo :)
Elissa what IS willpower anyway?
NancyM or is it about power at all
Ocallah a limp calls for healing the cause of the limp
WhiteTiger the only power there is nancy... the power to shape yer own path
Ocallah so that you don't even need a crutch
NancyM amen WT
RevRandy if the crutch replaces something that could work is one thing, but if it assists the working of something that needs help, that is another -- one is a substitute, the other an aid
TF88 I never liked the term will power...strikes me as being something that's forced despite...rather than creating a change
WhiteTiger most crutches are attention getters, in my experience, and never wee really needed in the first place
Elissa i was typing that, tf lol
TF88 LOL
Elissa but the person has to know it isn't needed before they can let go of it, wt
bluelight {--- thinks we should all confess our addictions :0
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bluelight hehehe
Ocallah i agree
NancyM truth elissa
TF88 ack...the should word!
RevRandy I will draw back to an original theme --- of the use of energy external to us; do we use it incidentally, or do we rely on it?
Elissa and more than that, they have to know there is something else that can help them better
bluelight {---- WANTS all to confess lolol
WhiteTiger if they're already using it for a security blankie, sure.. much easier to not start using it to begin with, though
Elissa confess, blue!!!
TF88 there you go blue!...but that doesn't mean I WANT to! hahahahahaha
RevRandy blue, are you addicted to confessing?
bluelight TF gotz secrets HAHAHA
Elissa i have so many... hmmm... where to begin lol
NancyM rofl Rev
TF88 I know blue :)
RevRandy well, let's move on to one more, provocative, Point to Ponder
bluelight addicted to laughing hehe
RevRandy 0,1KKK:
RevRandy 0,1
RevRandy 0,1"Are y'all white. I used to get all fired up with that question. O yes, I
RevRandy 0,1would shout it out and the boys would call back, ‘White as God-given rain.'
RevRandy 0,1And then I would say, ‘Let's show the others some of our white rain till
RevRandy 0,1their rain is red.' And we'd go and do our mischief.
RevRandy 0,1
bluelight RR wearing brain out per usual :0
RevRandy 0,1"But here's something I discovered: In my hate I could never do enough. You
RevRandy 0,1lynch somebody, and all you think about is how many more of ‘em are out
RevRandy 0,1there. You burn a house, and the next day all you see are the houses that
RevRandy 0,1haven't been burned. Until one day, I woke up and said to myself, ‘How many
RevRandy 0,1nights will it take until there ain't any more of them.' And I realized I
RevRandy 0,1didn't have that many nights. And I thought, ‘Wait, what am I doing. I'm
RevRandy 0,1trying the impossible,' and so every night I would waste with something I
RevRandy 0,1couldn't do. I was going down the tubes. So I stopped. And what I thought
RevRandy 0,1gave me power went away, and I was surprised how much more energy I felt. My
RevRandy 0,1own racism was demanding more than I had to give. It was a simple thing to
RevRandy 0,1get: What I thought I wanted would take more than I had to give. But, you
RevRandy 0,1know what sustained me for so long. The energy I got from others--and I
RevRandy 0,1don't mean the brothers, but those who were opposed to me. Man, you can suck
RevRandy 0,1on an angry catcall all day and it sure fires you up for another evening.
RevRandy 0,1But you know what, when I would go off fired up by them catcalls, whatever I
RevRandy 0,1did that night never seemed to equal what them folks had. The energy I
RevRandy 0,1sucked from their words was always negative.
RevRandy 0,1
RevRandy 0,1"The negative consequences to me were not of the actions themselves, but my
RevRandy 0,1feelings about them. Hey, I gonna use the slick talker's candle, too. Let's
RevRandy 0,1say you are in the dark, and someone comes along with a candle and shows the
RevRandy 0,1light of what you're up to, and you don't like that so you blow it out. Ok.
RevRandy 0,1You use energy to blow it out, and then you are left in the dark. Use energy
RevRandy 0,1to lose energy... not too damn smart. Sure, they all lose some energy, too;
RevRandy 0,1but the trick is they can always relight their candles, but you have to keep
RevRandy 0,1blowing ‘em out, and they that's got their own energy can outlast those of
RevRandy 0,1us blowing.
RevRandy 0,1
RevRandy 0,1"But here's what I found out later: If them same folks had gotten together
RevRandy 0,1with their candles, they could have done some good--helping some poor soul
RevRandy 0,1out of darkness who wanted out, rather than wasting their light on the likes
RevRandy 0,1of me. So, if you only got one candle don't waste it where darkness is
RevRandy 0,1valued. Use it where other lights can bring a sunrise. And don't believe
RevRandy 0,1that Clorox takes out blood stains. I go." (8/11/2000)
bluelight weird that KKK only thinks about his energy lost now about how others were feeling Elissa "And what I thought gave me power went away, and I was surprised how much more energy I felt".
bluelight well maybe he did here at the end with the candle thing..
RevRandy it was his path to understanding, to see what it was doing to him
NancyM woa
bluelight but when did he realize what it did to others
Elissa there's the key to how we help others without feeding their addiction
toolman everyone feeds off of the thoughts of others
RevRandy I think he realized what it did to others by recognizing what it did to himself
Elissa so what are you guys thinking about?
WhiteTiger imo, ya help others when asked for help... if it ain't solicited, yer stepping in the territory of the one and only
WhiteTiger in other words.. let 'em walk their paths, nle hey cross yers.. kkk had to walk a hard dark one to learn that lesson
WhiteTiger gah
NancyM lol
WhiteTiger typo monster :(
Elissa huh lol
toolman lol
RevRandy now with two fingers ....
bluelight we could discuss how to deal with people who suck energy
WhiteTiger *you* try this with paws :P
Elissa rofl!
RevRandy ROFLMAO
WhiteTiger ;)
NancyM oh man have i seen that suck
Elissa "if you only got one candle don't waste it where darkness is valued."
toolman how do you stop the energy from hitting you?
Elissa i love that
Elissa in other words, stop worrying about the skeptics lol
bluelight i have told people to find other friends .. is this what u mean?
NancyM cast not pearl b4 swine
Elissa depends on what people and why blue :)
RevRandy toolman, Rikkity had a whole discourse on putting "fuses" in our relationships so they cannot bleed us dry
WhiteTiger don't accept the energy...stand in yer own place, on yer own path... just cuz it's out there don't mean ya gotta let it sidetrack ya
RevRandy WT - that is easier said than done, many times, especially if we think we are in some love relationship with the other
Elissa and yet, wt, along with other candles we can create a brilliant blaze!
NancyM make your choice
toolman ive been standing next to strangers who were mad about something and there anger was so strong i almost passed out
bluelight i haven't always been aware of the lack of others' energy till it was very late
RevRandy so, take a step away
WhiteTiger I know R... but I can only speak from what I know/have done
Elissa i don't think this is saying we need to separate ourselves from others... just be realistic and intentional about it
toolman its not that easy
RevRandy and intentional ..... yes!
Elissa no it isn't, toolman
bluelight E .. that's enuf for them to want to lose u .. and that's ok too at times
Elissa yep, it's ok
toolman i couldnt move it paralyzed me!!!!
NancyM make your own kinda music... sing your own special song... make your own kinda music, even if nobody else sings along
RevRandy but did you learn from it?
NancyM love that song (giggle)
RevRandy would you stand next to those people again?
Elissa lol nancy
NancyM know when to hold em n when to fold em
NancyM lol
Elissa toolman, the thing is not to try to stop them or explain why they shouldn't be angry
Elissa focus your energy where it can be positive
NancyM right on E
toolman yes i beg those people to calm down and they are surprised to here that that there anger goes away long enough for me to leave
Elissa help someone they are angry with empower him/herself
toolman most people dont take to advise very kindly
RevRandy the trick is to not bring our own anger into the situation ...
Elissa as long as you use your energy to oppose them, you feed their anger and your energy is lost
NancyM unsolicited
toolman especially spiritual advice
toolman i dont oppose them i just try to get away
Elissa sometimes that's the best thing to do
NancyM i just say my truth n dont attach to anyone lovin it
RevRandy I am very taken by KKK's reference to what those with a sense of light could do, if they focused it positively, not in reaction to negative things
toolman im very sensitive to the way people feel around me
RevRandy think of what we each could do, and we all could do
Elissa yes nancy, just speak your truth in positive terms rather than reacting
NancyM amen
RevRandy if we got up each morning with the intention to not focus on what was wrong,
RevRandy but rather on what we would like to see better
RevRandy and working toward, not away
toolman positive thinking
RevRandy Positive intentionality
Elissa YES RR!
RevRandy and when we find others with a similar bent, look for the points of connection, not of differences
Elissa you go, rev :)
NancyM amen REV
Elissa preach it brother
RevRandy so often we let our collective light dissipate because we get caught looking at the little differences
RevRandy and miss the bigger dream we share
NancyM yep
bluelight u're right RevR .. intending this early in day if possible makes a big difference
NancyM awwww
bluelight but we can always 'start over' any time of the day ..thank goodness!
RevRandy The sides of hate, anger, fear ... they seem so powerful only because
RevRandy they don't worry about differences .... only about amassing as much energy as they can
* NancyM shakin head yes
RevRandy so, how about the forces of hope, of light, of love, taking a similar tack
RevRandy of seeing the big picture
RevRandy and agreeing that even if the final picture is not exactly as we had envisioned it, the picture we do get growing out of love
RevRandy hope
RevRandy and positive thoughts
bluelight maybe if we pretend how God is and c what it would b like to put our arms around every person .. not literally tho
RevRandy will be a picture in which we want to live
NancyM *G*
RevRandy The Rev is done ... he's said his piece and his peace.
NancyM (giggle)
Elissa and twas good :)
NancyM thx
bluelight sorry i interrupted RevR :(
RevRandy no problem -- hey - if you can see the picture of what can be, work for it!
* NancyM starts the dancing
Elissa even if you can't see it, work for a better future whatever that means to those who will live in it :)
RevRandy all right - dance time ... we are dancing Sarah's Circle
bluelight {--- tries forgets tries forgets what can she say..
RevRandy but she tries ...!!!!!!!
* Elissa twirls nancym around the room
NancyM ahhh hmmmmmmm there is no try
bluelight when i remember RR LOL
* Elissa lets nancy go and she falls on her butt :(
bluelight that's right Nancy .. c i fergot again LOL
bluelight E u so funny
RevRandy which is all that is required of us ... to be good enough people (not required to be perfect)
Elissa i amuse myself lol
* NancyM dips into someones arms and twirls out again
bluelight well guys i gotz to go.. thanku for the wonderful lessons they r
RevRandy and with that, we come to the end of our evening
* Elissa stands in awe of nancy's grace and graceful recovery
bluelight again .. Rikkity is so cool .. so r u !!
* NancyM lucky me i gots a tigger butt
Elissa hahahaha
RevRandy ty
RevRandy we be cool together
Elissa thanks blue... and thanks to all who stayed and danced and spoke their truth
bluelight u welcome :D
NancyM we be
Elissa and now it's time for the rainbow song once again
[SOUND]
* Playing txplay20.mrc to #SpiritualPersistence with 50ms delay
Elissa 11,2!Elissa rainbow.mid 2,11 :o)
bluelight nite nite gang :D
RevRandy nite all
Elissa nite and love to you all
bluelight nite nite E RR
NancyM to all sleep sweet this night
NancyM SMOOCHERS
Elissa thank you, dancing partner :)
NancyM TU dearheart
Elissa peaceful dreams all
Session Close: Sun Aug 13 23:05:44 2000