1107992

11/07/1999 - BACK TO THE RAINBOW: PURPOSE OF LIFE, CONNECTION, AND THE EVOLUTION OF THE SOUL

kath. . ..mary
kath. . . .had a friend
kath. . . .a friend who slept while she died
kath. . . .a friend who left her to this moment that was between her and God really,
suwan. . . .to me, unconditional love means that I love that guy who killed the 9 year old boy for no reason as much as I love my own child
RevRandy. . . .there are some, not many, who seem to be about connection more than differentiation, and they seem to embody such a love more than others
jsp. . . .ah
kath. . . .yes, i love the boy
kath. . . .who let mary die
kath. . . .who led her there
kath. . . .i send him love and pray
jsp. . . .suwan - i understand i think
journey. . . .has anyone ever read the book, the little soul and the sun?
journey. . . .it takes all of 5 minutes to read and has powerful message about unconditional love
Elissa. . . .no suwan, that's not how i think of it at all
suwan. . . .but if it is more than that elissa, you are putting conditions
TF88. . . .elissa, how do you think of it?
Elissa. . . .i just understand the love of the universe is as available to him as it is to anyone else. that doesn't mean i have to give it to him!!! it's already there and accessible
suwan. . . .lol
Elissa. . . .no conditions
kath. . . .i have anger, i have boundaries they are conditions for me, my life, they help me learn and i have experienced "unconditional" for first i was loved
suwan. . . .well that's what I'm saying, universal love is unconditional but I don't see it between two humans
Elissa. . . .ok
kath. . . .i will not defend what i KNOW
jsp. . . .((((kath)))))
Elissa. . . .no need to defend anything here kath
suwan. . . .kath i'm not attacking you
suwan. . . .or what you think I'm just saying what i think
kath. . . .((((suwan)))) i know that
journey. . . .i also think you can be extremely spiritual and still feel unpleasant emotions, especially about a love lost
jsp. . . .how about the parents who argued against the death penalty for the kid who killed their kid?
suwan. . . .ahhh jsp, now that's going into forgiveness
jsp. . . .and?
journey. . . .and unconditional love doesnt' all ways mean you are ready to forgive, you can love and keep working on it
Elissa. . . .jsp that was probably more for them than for him. randy and i have been told to do something similar for the drunk driver who killed ericka (rikkity)
TF88. . . .well, i had a family member murdered by an 18 year old male
TF88. . . .I unfortunately had the opportunity to witness varied reactions from loved ones
TF88. . . .it certainly brought the question of unconditional love to my mind
jsp. . . .i'll bet that's true TF88!
RevRandy. . . .so many different understandings .... all right for the person who speaks .... all paths on journeys toward wholeness
jsp. . . .we're all at different places on this journey and with our learning and remembering :) -- lots of good examples of that here it seems!
kath. . . .it is simply not a subject for debate
Elissa. . . .see i think we all feel like it means we're obligated to love everybody no matter what, and again we're trying to make it too concrete
RevRandy. . . .yep, and I embrace you all - wherever you are, however you express it - we are connected in this conversation, which shows we are open to learning, to growing
Elissa. . . .and i always learn something from hearing every different perspective
journey. . . .where one can feel forgiving and another cant, i feel each path still leads along the same road..to healing, but in your own time
jsp. . . .true
Elissa. . . .yes journey (aptly named)
journey. . . .ty, you have experienced a pain that i feel is incomprehensible for most of us, but i do feel love finds its way and healing must occur and what better way than sharing all of it
journey. . . .and in a place that does not Judge!!
jsp. . . .where does forgiving fall along the line towards unconditional love then :) ? - just to carry this a bit further
jsp. . . .what does that do for the one doing the "forgiving"?
kath. . . .i understand that i am connected to the boys who were accused of murdering mary,
TF88. . . .I think forgiving comes with understanding
Gus. . . .It is interesting to think that although there are so many different understandings we will ultimately find the same answer
TF88. . . .and when there is understanding, there is acceptance
jsp. . . .i agree tf88 - acceptance can only genuinely "take" when there is some degree of understanding
TF88. . . .and with accepting there is no room for hatred.
suwan. . . .welll I must add that my disbelief partially comes from the fact that each time my bratty stepson did something beyond the pale, he would whine for unconditional love
jsp. . . .that's called manipulation Suwan -- pure and simple
suwan. . . .no kidding
Elissa. . . .definitely
Elissa. . . .and you felt guilty about not being able to give it to him, suwan?
suwan. . . .no Elissa, I didn't feel guilty
Elissa. . . .ok good for you :)
XkuRUx. . . .unconditional luv would be not to condemn someone but to help him become a better person.
suwan. . . .ahhh xku, I will leave my stepson to have someone else help him become an better person
kath. . . .good plan suwan
jsp. . . .(probably will be his first wife....):)
Elissa. . . .lol jsp
XkuRUx. . . .Suwan- huh?
suwan. . . .i thought it was a way of diverting attention away from the issue at hand
XkuRUx. . . .suwan-sounds good
suwan. . . .and didn't exist
kath. . . .manipulation serves that purpose
jsp. . . .he's using some buzz words without knowing anything of meaning
jsp. . . .there's a "letting go" component to this question I think
jsp. . . .a broadening of the picture involved
Elissa. . . .yes jsp
suwan. . . .well just because you do not love someone does not mean you hate them
jsp. . . .apathy is the opposite of love, not hate is
journey. . . .you can wish them well and also wish them out of your life and that is healthy too, i think
TF88. . . .yes suwan, that is true...but if there is anger/hatred/malice, there is no chance for love
Elissa. . . .not at all suwan. he just knows how to push your buttons
jsp. . . .right
suwan. . . .: ) no more
suwan. . . .lol
jsp. . . .good for you!
Elissa. . . .what he does to you suwan is not loving, it's energy- sucking
Elissa. . . .YAY
jsp. . . .my favorite quote: "You can't get jerked around if you're not holding on to the chain...!"
Alisa. . . .like that quote jsp:)
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journey. . . .suwan, i think what bothers you is that you know what is going to be said before he says it..and it is not all that creative
Elissa. . . .lol
journey. . . .like you have heard it before
suwan. . . .no, journey, he is right, I do not love him unconditionally
suwan. . . .my love is conditioned on certain things
kath. . . .anger and boundaries are a part of self love
jsp. . . .so - have we lost the thread of "unconditional love"?
kath. . . .self love is essential
TF88. . . .self love or self protection?
kath. . . .self love is essential to "unconditional love"
suwan. . . .the question is should I love him unconditionally
jsp. . . .what would that do do you think if you could suwan?
TF88. . . .ack, that nasty "should' word
jsp. . . .yup tf88 that got me too
journey. . . .well, i wonder what part of him you can find inside yourself, because as much as we dislike them at times they resonate with something in us to push those buttons
Elissa. . . .suwan, needing something in return is ok
Elissa. . . .listen to what that's telling you
suwan. . . .and if I love someone must it be unconditional?
TF88. . . .only if you choose it to be suwan!
kath. . . .love without condition does not mean letting someone suck you dry or beat you up emotionally
suwan. . . .why not kath?
kath. . . .what kind of love that would that be to your self
jsp. . . .you can love them - over there too :)
Elissa. . . .suwan if you don't feel that then trying to pretend you do would not serve anyone
kath. . . .lies serve no one
suwan. . . .no I dont' pretend to love someone unconditionally
TF88. . . .loving someone does not equal loving their behavior
jsp. . . .right!
jsp. . . .or their actions
XkuRUx. . . .i don't see how that would happen kath if u luv urself
kath. . . .are you serious X
kath. . . .let life present you with the opportunity, then you can experience it
journey. . . .unconditional love i think means, you see it, recognize it honestly, identify with it and then choose, but see the big picture and never think that the one who has your number hasn't got a little of you in them
kath. . . .yes journey
journey. . . .just a thought, because that person is probably trying equally as hard as you to find this middle ground, no one really likes adversity over love
RevRandy. . . .friends - I have one more little Point to share, a point for the road, so to speak
jsp. . . .please Rev!
RevRandy. . . . 13,2"What we need to do is realize that we are an entity of complex personal relationships.
RevRandy. . . . 13,2 We sense that, but when we remember that all of us remember that, then we will begin to function as that
RevRandy. . . . 13,2as components--and we will evolve in the next stage of spiritual development." (1/5/96 - V#4)
XkuRUx. . . .kath-dunno. this conversation is confusing. everyone is contradicting their own words 2 minutes later.
TF88. . . .Xku, everyone has permission to change his/her mind at any point
XkuRUx. . . .I dont see how u can put luv in words. it's like art
jsp. . . .that's a key there, what Rev just posted
RevRandy. . . . 13,2"What we need to do is realize that we are an entity of complex personal relationships.
RevRandy. . . . 13,2 We sense that, but when we remember that all of us remember that, then we will begin to function as that
RevRandy. . . . 13,2as components--and we will evolve in the next stage of spiritual development." (1/5/96 - V#4)
Elissa. . . .Xku this conversation is for exploring our feelings and not for coming to any definite conclusions
Elissa. . . .it's a journey not a destination :)
RevRandy. . . .I'll leave that for you to contemplate and ponder!
Elissa. . . .thank you randy
jsp. . . .everyone we come in contact with has something to teach us, if we're open to it :)
jsp. . . .even stepsons
jsp. . . .(perhaps especially....)
suwan. . . .oh yes jsp, he has taught me a great deal!
kath. . . .interesting journey tonite, i am awakened
TF88. . . .suwan, thank you for sharing your thoughts... more input to ponder :)
jsp. . . .yes!!!
Elissa. . . .and thank you everyone for coming and participating in this VERY stimulating discussion!!!
journey. . . .ty randy and i think there are so many layers to each person, lifetimes of layers
RevRandy. . . .being open to the possibility, especially the ones we did not know were possible, is the start of process
jsp. . . .LOL!
Elissa. . . .please feel free to hang out and continue to chat
RevRandy. . . .Ponder On!
RevRandy. . . .song time
[SOUND]
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Elissa. . . . 3,0!Elissa rainbow.mid 0,3 :o)
journey. . . .should we do room hug?
jsp. . . .bravo :)
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Elissa. . . .((((((((((((((SP)))))))))))))))))))
RevRandy. . . .((((((((((room)))))))))))
suwan. . . .xku I'm not sure I understand what you just said?
XkuRUx. . . .Suwan-i've never put effort into not luving someone. is that simpler?
suwan. . . .ahhhh I see
suwan. . . .never? wow, you are at a level I could only dream of
kath. . . .here's a question, "shall i choose Unconditional love" and if i do, does that negate the process?
Elissa. . . .you guys are great!!! i'm so wired!!!
journey. . . .sometimes i think we should close with a thought of prayer for understanding
jsp. . . .LOL!
Lions. . . .Hi Everyone!
Elissa. . . .hi lions!
TF88. . . .night everyone
TF88. . . .light and love
jsp. . . .can you love someone you're also angry with ? :)
suwan. . . .oh sure jsp
jsp. . . .that's part of it it seems to me... :)
RevRandy. . . .night all ..... the traveling Rev needs to go.
journey. . . .Light and Love and may we all gain from this sharing of mutual expression in truth!
jsp. . . .night rev!
suwan. . . .night rev
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XkuRUx. . . .Suwan-well i'm trying to think of some. it doesn't last long. i usually see past characters pretty quick. i think anyway *shrugs*
Lions. . . .What are you guys talking about?
suwan. . . .love lions
jsp. . . .unconditional love, lions
journey. . . .unconditional love
Lions. . . .I am very much in love!!!!!!!!!!!!
jsp. . . .good for you! :D LOL! that's great!
Lions. . . .Unconditional love too
Elissa. . . .wonderful lions!
journey. . . .good for you hon! May it last forever!
kath. . . .confession, i have experienced unconditional love with my husband, but that was only when he really needed it, it must have come from the source. our every day life is not "unconditional love" to say the least
suwan. . . .lol kath

kath. . . .thats real
XkuRUx. . . .:O)~
kath. . . .lol
Elissa. . . .lol kath i'm glad. i'd worry about anyone who didn't expect something from their husband
jsp. . . .but i'll bet it's an undercurrent kath -- there like a radio wave is still in the room even if there's no radio to pick up on it
jsp. . . .to me it's like that
kath. . . .confession, i was born with it
kath. . . .like a defect
jsp. . . .LOL!
kath. . . .my mother wondered about me
suwan. . . .but, the question then is if you are saying, hmmm I am extending unconditional love (presumably despite something) because he needs it, isn't that the condition?
suwan. . . .because he needs it?
Elissa. . . .i know that's not where we want to get to, but it's where we are :)
kath. . . .no spontaneous
jsp. . . .hmmmm..... maybe we're playing two levels against each other in this discussion.... the "human interaction" part which is heavily involved with likes and angers and frustrations and behaviors, and the more underlying level of fundamentals -- that we can from time to time let come to the surface more easily
jsp. . . .yes kath - it's more something that i think we LET happen rather than MAKE happen
kath. . . .not possible to force it
jsp. . . .it's the REMEMBERING part that Rikkity talks of sometimes -- at least that's how i've seen it in her points
jsp. . . .and the getting the self/judgements/etc out of the way so that the heart connection is closer to the surface
suwan. . . .and I will agree with you that we all have moments of spontaneous love for husbands and all sorts of people
suwan. . . .but (at least for me) that generally passes
kath. . . .this is when i miss mary so much, and appreciate being able to express this
Elissa. . . .i think you're onto something there, jsp. and i suspect one of the keys is acceptance...yes and remembering!!!
jsp. . . .what would happen if you kept the channel to that same wavelength a bit longer suwan?
jsp. . . .like a radio wave in the room, keep open to the heart there just a bit longer?
jsp. . . .and let the human part take care of it's own for a bit
jsp. . . .? :)
suwan. . . .a bit longer?
suwan. . . .not talking about length
suwan. . . .I'm just talking about conditions eventually integrating themselves into the equation
Elissa. . . .one of the reasons it's so important to trust ourselves is that then we can trust our responses to things like people who make us crazy :)
kath. . . .yes....
Lions. . . .May i join in ......i don't want to be rude. I usually go to the Lobby chat. First time here.
jsp. . . .yes elissa! so true
Elissa. . . .please do, lions!
suwan. . . .sure lions welcome, join in
suwan. . . .for example, I love my brother,
suwan. . . .but if I found out that he beats his wife, my love for him would be sorely challenged
Lions. . . .Thank you Elissa & suwan
Elissa. . . .understandable
jsp. . . .on one level yes
kath. . . .my heart would ache for him on another level
Elissa. . . .and enormous disappointment probably
jsp. . . .but i'd bet there continues that undercurrent of love there too suwan
suwan. . . .yes an undercurrent jsp
jsp. . . .that heart connection - it does go on
suwan. . . .but i would also wonder if I truly knew who he was
suwan. . . .and if the person I loved really existed
journey. . . .yes, but do you know what drives him? and can you truly judge?
jsp. . . .and you'd likely want to talk to him about this, right?
kath. . . .but if this is your brother, you would remember also the place of lack he came from
XkuRUx. . . .helping him not do it. wouldn't that be unconditional luv?
Alisa. . . .a trust issue suwan?
Elissa. . . .you'd wonder if you'd been wrong about him
suwan. . . .yep e
Elissa. . . .but you had no way of knowing before it happened
jsp. . . .and you'd wonder too about if/how you could have missed something about him too...
kath. . . .that is more facing our own projection elissa
Elissa. . . .sometimes kath, and sometimes it's just that we hate being wrong or think we've made a mistake when it's the other person who has made the mistake
kath. . . .without our own projection, right or wrong is irrelevant
suwan. . . .just an example, don't think my poor brother is beating anyone
XkuRUx. . . .nope
jsp. . . .LOL!
kath. . . .LOL
journey. . . .can you speak your truth to him and lay it out honestly from your standpoint with room to spare for his response or will you shut down
XkuRUx. . . .i think luving someone would be to make them grow
suwan. . . .xku, now I have to disagree with that one to
Elissa. . . .xku YES but only when love is a 2-way street, and i think that's what your having trouble with suwan
jsp. . . ..... can't MAKE anybody grow folks.....
suwan. . . .nope jsp is right
suwan. . . .when you love you are the one who grows
Elissa. . . .it's not the concept of unconditional love, it's one-way love. there's a difference i think
journey. . . .why is understanding so hard?
jsp. . . .we make it that way sometimes journey
suwan. . . .you can't expect or make anyone else grow
XkuRUx. . . .Suwan-i thought so :o)~ it's ok. i'm not good in this conversation.
XkuRUx. . . .Suwan-nope u can't but u can try. it's the helping. not the making
Lions. . . .Suwan (forgive me i'm trying to understand) are you looking for love?
suwan. . . .no Lions I'm not
jsp. . . .we are discussing a topic of "unconditional love" lions
jsp. . . .this is not a pick up joint - there are other websites for that :)
Elissa. . . .lol jsp
suwan. . . .oh shoot!
journey. . . .i think you can understand and dislike and agree to disagree and still feel love for the person
jsp. . . .me too journey
journey. . . .you can simply let them go with love
suwan. . . .yes journey of course you can otherwise you wouldn't have marriages
jsp. . . .that heart connection - underneath the visible circumstances, underneath the human stuff
Elissa. . . .so do you guys think there's a difference between one-way love and unconditional love? i'm not sure really, but i have the sense there may be
suwan. . . .Elissa I think is zooming in on the question
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jsp. . . .i think one can have both Elissa
jsp. . . .one-way or un-requited love?
suwan. . . .is unconditional love one way love
kath. . . .i did something "stupid" recently, something that i really was embarrassed for my daughter in spirit to "see", what it became for me was another opportunity to know love without condition
kath. . . .to receive love
jsp. . . .neat kath!
journey. . . .i believe all love is unconditional, it is judgement that needs to be left aside to the creator
jsp. . . .that happens all the time - unconditional love is still there, if we're tuned in to it
jsp. . . .and has nothing to do with getting anything back
Lions. . . .unconditional love is loving a person....EVERYTHING about them. Including their faults and Good points.
suwan. . . .oh really lions?
jsp. . . .disagree here lions
suwan. . . .and do you have that
Elissa. . . .i disagree as well
googoodolls. . . .disagree also
Elissa. . . .i don't think it serves anyone to have their faults loved actively, but accepted is something else
Lions. . . .Why?
kath. . . .see to me we are the judgers and the creator is without judgement, i don't vision a judging God
XkuRUx. . . .disagree also *just says it to have something to talk about*
Elissa. . . .lol xku
journey. . . .especially recognizing that in each of their unacceptable points lies something within ourselves we too dislike, perhaps not exactly the same ,but there none the less
jsp. . . .i think it involves separating out some things -- and understanding of such things can be greatly benefitted by having a larger than average "world view" of what may actually be the context that our little human minds are grasping at for the moment
Elissa. . . .maybe. faults are fun to laugh at if they're not too serious
Lions. . . .So if my boyfriend makes a mistake, i'm not suppose to love him?
suwan. . . .well there are big faults and there are little faults
jsp. . . .some faults can be the opportunity to learn big things
kath. . . .i vision multitude of opportunities for healing and love and integration
suwan. . . .there are rude noises at dinner and there is betrayal
suwan. . . .somewhere on the scale you stop laughing
Elissa. . . .jsp, i think you're right to keep asking us to expand the context here
kath. . . .betrayal forced my hand
kath. . . .i did not laugh
jsp. . . .and the gift comes suwan when one can step back to find the bigger picture, the lessons and the gift of it all -- in even the worst of circumstances
jsp. . . .(sure hoping so!)
Elissa. . . .but aren't we focusing outside ourselves again (big surprise lol)
journey. . . .i believe we are all responsible for all of it in some way
kath. . . .yes we do create
suwan. . . .yes jsp, I got the lesson I got the forgiveness, I just don't have the love
jsp. . . .it does involve letting go of the hurt - but not letting go of the person
journey. . . .and finding your part in it, helps you grown and learn and forgive
journey. . . .even if it means you can no longer live with, or look at that person, you can still send them out with love and go on
jsp. . . .what love are you looking for there suwan?
suwan. . . .I'm not
suwan. . . .i just don't have any love to give
suwan. . . .I certainly don't expect to get any
jsp. . . .ah! OK!! The love DOES NOT ORIGINATE IN YOU to give!!!
jsp. . . .it's more a matter of tuning in to the flow and letting it go right on through
jsp. . . .that process is what nourishes YOU
journey. . . .Suwan, Bless You..you are teaching us!
Elissa. . . .yes jsp!!!
jsp. . . .it's very much like tuning in to that wavelength...
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suwan. . . .hmmm jsp
Elissa. . . .it's allowing it to flow, letting go of control and trusting the process!
jsp. . . .when the flow is not happening it's not a failing of anybody, it's just a matter of returning the radio
suwan. . . .I'm not with you guys
jsp. . . .it is not up to us to JUDGE whether or not anybody DESERVES "our" love... that's not in the equation
Elissa. . . .it's not up to you to control the love that comes to anyone else, suwan
jsp. . . .it's a matter of letting it flow
jsp. . . .is this making sense suwan?
suwan. . . .nope
jsp. . . .ok :)
jsp. . . .um - where did we lose you?
XkuRUx. . . .i think i just figured out why u guys are so at a lost about luv. ur placing it in events. he said this. he did this.
Elissa. . . .yes xku, that's what jsp and i are saying i think
jsp. . . .right Xku - and that's a different "level" than "unconditional love"...
jsp. . . .a different question
suwan. . . .I agree that it is not up to me to determine someone else's intrinsic value or worthiness for love
journey. . . .suwan, i feel you are very, very angry and are having hard time seeing past the anger
jsp. . . .it's ok to be where you are - each of us is where we're at and where we need to be :)
suwan. . . .nope I'm not angry at all
journey. . . .yes you are, perhaps angry that you dont feel love even
journey. . . .and thought you would
suwan. . . .no journey I am not angry at all
suwan. . . .I used to be angry but I have worked through that and forgiven
suwan. . . .but it is up to me whether I want to be in a relationship with him where love flows between us (sheesh that sounds corny!)
jsp. . . .not in the least
Elissa. . . .yes suwan, that's true
XkuRUx. . . .LOL. luv is korny
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jsp. . . .you're right!
Bobbie. . . .hi gang!
Elissa. . . .but you don't have to be in a relationship all by yourself!!!
jsp. . . .the decision to stay or go is unrelated to that of "unconditional love"
suwan. . . .I just don't love him
Lions. . . .I have unconditional love for my boyfriend and some family members.
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jsp. . . .don't have to suwan
Elissa. . . .no suwan. he'll be loved whether or not you love him. it's not up to you.
Elissa. . . .no one owns love and has the power to give it or take it from someone else
XkuRUx. . . .Suwan-who are u talking about?
suwan. . . .my stepson
journey. . . .what holds you back from moving on?
suwan. . . .nothing journey
suwan. . . .I have moved on
Elissa. . . .suwan, you just sound frustrated to me
suwan. . . .it is just an example for discussion
Elissa. . . .ok
kath. . . .and a good one suwan
XkuRUx. . . .suwan-oh ok. why what did he do?
Elissa. . . .a very good one!
kath. . . .cause we all have people who push our buttons
kath. . . .and that is the big one
journey. . . .sorry, but you sound so p'od you could you pop! :)

Elissa. . . .o yeah! especially stepkids lol
suwan. . . .nope he is just being him
jsp. . . .doesn't matter xku
XkuRUx. . . .jsp- just feel like i'm missing something in this conversation
jsp. . . .hang in there xku! LOL! :)
dona_cox. . . .hello there everyone
Elissa. . . .hi dona
kath. . . .its easy to love one who is so like they are part of our own soul group
suwan. . . .I am just back to where I started that unconditional love can come from God or the universe but does not flow between people
Elissa. . . .hey boobie :)
Bobbie. . . .and so easy to be disappointed when we find out that they
Bobbie. . . .aren't
suwan. . . .Hey boobie!
Bobbie. . . .hiya gang!
Elissa. . . .bobbie we missed ya!
Bobbie. . . .thanks....I've missed everyone too
jsp. . . .ok - why not suwan? why doesn't it flow between people do you think?
suwan. . . .I just think there are always conditions jsp whether we acknowledge them or not
jsp. . . .who's conditions?
jsp. . . .where do they come from suwan?
jsp. . . .and what purpose do they serve?
suwan. . . .well I think they come from our ego
suwan. . . .I'm not sure what purpose they serve
suwan. . . .but, i'm not sure what purpose love serves
Elissa. . . .they come i think because we all have needs... empty places that we look to get filled from others
jsp. . . .just to be clear: you're talking about the "i'll only love you IF...." kind of thing?
kath. . . .thats called bargaining
suwan. . . .yes jsp but what I am saying is that even if we don't say that there are always some kind of conditions on our love
Bobbie. . . .my "IF" on that one jan is that "IF you don't use my love against me, to hurt and use me"....
jsp. . . .such as?? i'm trying to be sure i'm on the same wavelength myself here...
suwan. . . .that in love between people conditions are a given, they change depending on the relationships but they are always there
kath. . . .what if there were no conditions?
kath. . . .what if?
kath. . . .would we need a new word
suwan. . . .you tell me what if?
jsp. . . .i agree kath.... needing a new word here.....
suwan. . . .I can't imagine the scenario
XkuRUx. . . .me neither. there would be no exchange if there waz nothing in common or a goal
jsp. . . .ok
jsp. . . .ah but there are always connections Xku....!
XkuRUx. . . .hmm that didn't make sense
kath. . . .what is agape
kath. . . .that is close
Bobbie. . . .read mine from above suwan....
suwan. . . .????
Bobbie. . . .the "if" on mine suwan
Elissa. . . .i think there will always be conditions as long as we look for what we need outside ourselves
kath. . . .good point Elissa
jsp. . . .let's for a moment come back to the "connections" part -- and set the "conditions" part to the side for the moment
jsp. . . .there are connections between us all - you all here, the guy on the street, the drunk in the cell, the president wherever he is...
jsp. . . .there are connections - and this concept of "unconditional love" has more to do with the quality of THAT i think,
jsp. . . .this is what Sister Theresa was able to focus on
jsp. . . .to some degree others of us have our times :)
Elissa. . . .:)
XkuRUx. . . .*scorns Suwan for starting this conversation*!!!
Elissa. . . .xku is so fed up he finds it impossible to leave LOL
suwan. . . .kind of like eating chocolate and watching nick at nite with the remote on the other side of the room, huh, E?
Elissa. . . .lol suwan
Bobbie. . . .jsp....sad to say I've only found that type of love from my animals....
jsp. . . .animals and pets are perhaps the greatest teachers of this very thing Bobbie!!!! Exactly so!
Bobbie. . . .they are the only safe ones jan......
Bobbie. . . .the only ones you can really count on to give that in return
Elissa. . . .o yes! my cat taught me about unconditional love. no doubt about that. i learn every day from watching my mufi :)
kath. . . .and cleaning mufi's kitty litter
Elissa. . . .lol kath yuck pew
journey. . . .i knew unconditional love once
joesmom. . . .Yes, Sister Teresa saw God in all children (and maybe all people as well) So - I find that unconditional love is my soul loving another's soul because I know God loves them. I may not like what they have done, but I cannot judge.
jsp. . . .right joesmom!!!!
joesmom. . . .It makes the whole concept easy.
kath. . . .i try to give kath unconditional love every moment, now that is a challenge
jsp. . . .ah - but think of it for a moment.... we can tune in to that universal unconditional love perhaps even easiest when we think we're alone!
Elissa. . . .o yes, i try to do that too kath...to me i mean lol
jsp. . . .now, self-love, that's a real tough one
kath. . . .thats the core
joesmom. . . .I do believe however that unconditional love can exist between parent and child.
jsp. . . .me too - and between partners
jsp. . . .sometimes :)
joesmom. . . .Not between partners
journey. . . .the beauty of the world is unconditional, it is ego i think that sets up the struggle
joesmom. . . .Many different types of love.
kath. . . .miracle between partners
jsp. . . .I think of it like the mountains behind the fog -- it's there, just can't see it all the time
joesmom. . . .Yes, it would have to be a miracle.
jsp. . . .miracles happen :)
Bobbie. . . .but sometimes jan, it isn't there at all, just an illusion
jsp. . . .but maybe it is Bobbie :) - maybe not an illusion at all
suwan. . . .if it is "between" it is, by definition, conditional
jsp. . . .that's where the trust part comes in
jsp. . . .and expectation
Bobbie. . . .only sometimes jan, only sometimes
Bobbie. . . .and trust is a big issue with me
jsp. . . .((((Bobbie)))))))
Bobbie. . . .thanks jan, I needed that tonight
jsp. . . .aww here's another! (((((BOBBIE)))))))))) as many as you like
Bobbie. . . .thanks.....it's been a rough week
kath. . . .yes true sample of unconditional, nature just is and a process is.....
kath. . . .we can impact nature and skew the process, but the process of nature is set
journey. . . .i think we in our learning process, confuse and confound it, love..we all search for perfection and usually outside ourselves
jsp. . . .agreed journey
kath. . . .it just is, love just is, no matter how we interpret it or experience it, there is an energy that evolves and exists
jsp. . . .agreed kath
joesmom. . . .OK - I have enjoyed this. I have a date with "Unconditional Love" early in the morning and need to say goodnight.,
jsp. . . .LOL joesmom!
journey. . . .nite joesmom, sleep well!
Bobbie. . . .Good night, joesmom! 11,13God bless and 8,12^Å^ 11,12angels 8,12^Å^ keep!
Elissa. . . .((((((joesmom)))))) thanks for coming tonight and joining us
jsp. . . .we're with you :)
joesmom. . . .No really -
joesmom. . . .I am going to 7 am Mass!
XkuRUx. . . .LOL. i Told someone yesterday that the (((((((persons name)))))) waz a psychic radio wave that can only be understood between the 2 ppl
jsp. . . .not far off there xku :)
Elissa. . . .hahahaha xku you're a hoot!
jsp. . . .it's a hug for sure!
kath. . . .pray for me
joesmom. . . .Thanks all.
joesmom. . . .Yes, I'll pray for your soul kath -
journey. . . .pray for mine too joesmom!
joesmom. . . .or your spirit, whichever you prefer
journey. . . .try to fit me in if you can, i need it too!
joesmom. . . .OK Journey]
journey. . . .ty
joesmom. . . .The prayers of a righteous man (in this case woman) availeth much.
kath. . . .thankyou joesmom
joesmom. . . .Goodnight
kath. . . .sweet dreams
journey. . . .Bless you hon, dream well!
journey. . . .anybody want teddy grahams?...last offer! :)
XkuRUx. . . .no more unconditional luv talk? *say no LOL*
Elissa. . . .o may i have some please journey?
journey. . . .happy to send snack to you Elissa!
Elissa. . . .you know you want more xku
XkuRUx. . . .ELissa-NOPE!
kath. . . .oke good nite
kath. . . .sending love, unconditional love that is....
kath. . . .lol
kath. . . .good nite
Elissa. . . .nite dearest kath...
Bobbie. . . .Good night, kath! 11,13God bless and 8,12^Å^ 11,12angels 8,12^Å^ keep!
Elissa. . . .keep sending that love whether they want it or not!!!
journey. . . .You opened this can of worms...hehe, much to think and ponder upon.
suwan. . . .night kath
kath. . . .((((Elissa))))
kath. . . .(((((Bobbie, suwan, room)))))))
*** kath (k.cade@24.27.81.***) has left #SpiritualPersistence
suwan. . . .well just pass them around journey
Elissa. . . .yes journey, much to ponder
XkuRUx. . . .just do. don't ponder
journey. . . .ok, suwan, but dont forget, with teddy grahams, you have to dunk them in milk!
suwan. . . .lol
suwan. . . .someday journey I'll tell you my graham cracker story
journey. . . .:-)
journey. . . .it might shock me too much suwan and after all...I am shy! :)
Elissa. . . .suwan you can't just say that and then not tell!
Bobbie. . . .I don't know E, the only unconditional love I've ever gotten has come from my pup's, everyone else has something I have/need to live up to....:(
jsp. . . .well - it's a start :) pups, kitties, it's a place to start
Elissa. . . .bobbie, i think that's a common experience
Bobbie. . . .I've always had it from them jan, and my horses too, humans are a different story
jsp. . . .a breed unto them own selves! LOL!
XkuRUx. . . .well i hope u have something to contribute.
XkuRUx. . . .*shuts his big trap. don't wanna restart the conversation*
Elissa. . . .lol
suwan. . . .well every night before he went to bed my dad had graham crackers and milk
suwan. . . .always nabisco honey grahams
suwan. . . .always the same number
suwan. . . .always dunked in milk
journey. . . .yep,...i checked the box, same brand
suwan. . . .when nabisco went on strike
suwan. . . .my mother had to search the city for "grammies" as we used to call them
Elissa. . . .o no
suwan. . . .one day when I was over 40 I went to visit
suwan. . . .and he was eating vanilla wafers!
jsp. . . .oh my!
suwan. . . .asked him why
suwan. . . ."Got tired of them"
Elissa. . . .change is good
jsp. . . .LOL!
journey. . . .suwan...you are the kindest most straightforward person i have ever met on the net, thanks for sharing so much tonight!
suwan. . . .thanks journey
journey. . . .yw
jsp. . . .see - there's always hope :)
Elissa. . . .so funny!
suwan. . . .yep that's my dad!
Alisa. . . .yes, thanks Suwan:)
XkuRUx. . . .huh oh..there's that luv thing. RUN SUWAN LOL
Elissa. . . .suwan is a sweetie-pie and has the best sense of humor!
jsp. . . .got a cute kitty here wanting to sit on the 6666krynostf
jsp. . . .keyboard
jsp. . . .sheesh!
journey. . . .nah..suwan knows how to make people think and the buttons to push
Elissa. . . .i love you Xku :)
Elissa. . . .hahahaha
XkuRUx. . . .thnx
*** anne (ADCjava@***.ipt.aol.com) has joined #SpiritualPersistence
Alisa. . . .I had a horrible headache all day today...til an hour ago....it's gone:)you guys are wonderful
Elissa. . . .((((((alisa)))))))
Elissa. . . .we took away alisa's headache and gave it to xku lol
Alisa. . . .lol
XkuRUx. . . .well i gotta go. c yah guys Later
jsp. . . .night xKU!
suwan. . . .night xku
Bobbie. . . .Good night, XkuRUx! 11,13God bless and 8,12^Å^ 11,12angels 8,12^Å^ keep!
Elissa. . . .nite xku
jsp. . . .shoot - i got to run
suwan. . . .yep me too
jsp. . . .see y'all later! lotsa love and sweet dreams too!
Bobbie. . . .Good night, jsp! 11,13God bless and 8,12^Å^ 11,12angels 8,12^Å^ keep!
XkuRUx. . . .==================GONERZ_------------------
Alisa. . . .nite everyone:)
Bobbie. . . .me too, see you guys hopefully tomorrow night!
Elissa. . . .nite alisa. sweet dreams
Bobbie. . . .Night all and God Bless!
Alisa. . . .:0
Elissa. . . .time to go to bed i think.
suwan. . . .I'm going to bed too, love you all
suwan. . . .night
journey. . . .you both are very inspirational and i have gained much every time from being here
journey. . . .ty
Elissa. . . .thank you for saying that, journey. we love doing this.
Elissa. . . .and now i gotta go. you guys can stay
journey. . . .sometimes when i say things it comes out different that i mean, like harder than i feel, know what i mean
Elissa. . . .i know. it's hard when you're chatting and have 2 seconds to express your deepest thoughts :)
journey. . . .ty, goodnite elissa, see ya another time
Elissa. . . .nite all
Session Close: Mon Nov 08 00:26:54 1999

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